• NOW LIVE! Into the Woods--new character species, eerie monsters, and haunting villains to populate the woodlands of your D&D games.

How much backlash is too much?

And if they're not good enough friends to work with you even that far, why would you want to hang out with them at all, let alone game with them?

I agree, pretty much up to here.

Sometimes, people want, completely, different things from rpgs- even best friends. I have a friend that likes to play evil characters when he games. I hate it. Yet, no matter how hard he tries, he, eventually, slips back into this mode.

Based upon his gaming style, one would think he is a jerk and not someone you would want as a friend.

However, away from the table, this guy has had my back and that of others though very hard times. He will be the first to call a friend if they are sick or ill. If they are going through a hard time, he will call them up and take them to lunch and listen if they want to talk. I even witnessed him help a friend/co-worker of his cover rent when they got fired by the corporate office .

The key is just realizing that sometimes play styles are too divergent and it is better not to game with some people than try to be inclusive to everyone's style
 

log in or register to remove this ad

I agree, pretty much up to here.

Sometimes, people want, completely, different things from rpgs- even best friends. I have a friend that likes to play evil characters when he games. I hate it. Yet, no matter how hard he tries, he, eventually, slips back into this mode.

Oh, sure. I didn't mean to imply that everyone is capable of gaming with anyone. I just meant that they should be at least willing to make the attempt to work together to work it out.
 

Really? The Paladin was such a moron that he was running around at -1hp and forced a confrontation with a jerk he suspected of unleashing some demons?

Guess that Paladin was lawful stupid, not lawful good.

Exceptionally poor DMing on your part in my honest opinion. If you wanted the RP, have it after the paladin is healed. Only a total fool would do what you had that paladin do. He does have a reasonable wisdom score doesn't he?

Teleport directly behind the paladin without him having a chance to react? Sounds like a 1st ed AD&D assassin/magic user for the evil player PC.

Did the player know he would kill the paladin? Or did he think it would disable?

In anycase what is done is done. The town should lynch the PC or other excute him. The others should be ran out of town. IMC if a PC did what that one did he would be put to death if the town was capable of making that happen.
 

My easy fix

The paladin served Heironius? Well, that temple gets word that one of their Knights was murdered - likely sent via one of the disgruntled townsfolk. The message also included word of a gate to hell being opened. Needless to say they should send in a small army. Bent on a) ensuring the gate is closed permanently and b) ending your evil group.

How I do it - I make sure they play Good/Neutral characters all of the time, with no exceptions - until we get to a good stopping point in our main campaign, then I make then ALL create hideously evil nasty characters and let them get it out of their system. After a few games they self destruct being busy betraying one another, or, they end up biting off far more than they can chew (IE: Taking over the world, etc). The good guys invariably show up and wipe them out - and just to add a twist of fun, I like them to be using their own powerful good/neutral PCs to do said wiping.
 

I'm not sure if I feel the evil character actually did anything wrong. He was relaxing at a tavern when the paladin barged in, threw him on the table, and threatened him. The NE character defended himself. While the intentions of the paladin might have been Good, I do not believe they were Lawful. It seems to me that -by Law- the NE character was within his rights to defend himself.
 

I'm not sure if I feel the evil character actually did anything wrong. He was relaxing at a tavern when the paladin barged in, threw him on the table, and threatened him. The NE character defended himself. While the intentions of the paladin might have been Good, I do not believe they were Lawful. It seems to me that -by Law- the NE character was within his rights to defend himself.

Did the paladin pin the NE character to the table with his sword? Escalating from fisticuffs and grappling to lethal force is hard to justify. Especially against a Paladin who would tend to be unlikely to escalate themselves.
 

Did the paladin pin the NE character to the table with his sword? Escalating from fisticuffs and grappling to lethal force is hard to justify. Especially against a Paladin who would tend to be unlikely to escalate themselves.


Paladins are known to wield divine magical powers with nothing more than a touch. In world where that is common knowledge, I'd think that 'fisticuffs' would be just as viable as a deadly weapon as a sword.

Also, who is to say the paladin was unlikely to escalate things? He already barged into the tavern and assaulted someone.
 

It seems to me that -by Law- the NE character was within his rights to defend himself.

1. Depends on the law
2. Adventurers that stick around in one place for long are usually dead adventurers because it's their jobs to do things that piss off powerful people that generally do have power bases.
3. Point two is more prevalent for evil characters because good characters of any renown are usually tougher than similarly inclined evil characters per the old axiom:

The forces of evil are legion and weak while the forces of good are few and strong. (of course PCs may be the exception if they are evil, but the standard fantasy tropes are what they are.)

If the town is neutral:

Word gets around. Certainly the majority won't care much to say anything to the evil Swordsage, but I expect that the following will happen.

a. Those of lawful good alignment are going to be negatively disposed towards the character and his known associates. They may go to very extreme lengths to ensure that the innocent are protected but are very likely to measure their options before addressing him.

b. Those who were directly associated with the dead paladin are going to want blood, in the short term.

c. Those who were loosely or professionally associated with the dead paladin are going to respond in some way depending on how important he was. Friends may want blood, others may want justice. Higher ups will not want the random slaying of one of their own to reflect on the reputation of the order.

d. Neutrals will be cautious around anyone who kills someone in broad daylight in a tavern with no concern for witnesses. The thieves' guild will likely move operations out of the tavern for a while if any exist (thus costing them some money) and some may not want to do business with him simply because he causes trouble.

e. Anyone with an agenda against the paladin or his order may, quietly reach out to feel the character out. Certainly not all of the outcomes result in punitive things happening. Brazen-ness causes curiosity.

f. Less good types will either avoid him to keep their own profile low, start rumors that they really killed the Paladin to better serve their purposes and annoy the PC, see him as a threat to their own power and squash him or try to use him to further their own ends.

g. Either way, bards will start spinning tales about the death of the paladin and where that goes will amplify the above over time as the word of mouth spreads to other townships. See point about adventuring groups needing to move around.

Personally, I'd be doing all of the above and then at some point months later in the timeline create a nasty storyline where the player (after having done something else equally evil) be brought before a tribunal of some kind where he's given a choice of either serving a significant prison sentence or taking on a quest to kill some significant good being of ridiculous power because the ruling body of Lawful Evils heard about how "he single-handedly bested the epic level leader of the Knights of Heironius in mortal combat" when he was off-handedly slighted in (insert name of town here).

Bards love playing telephone.

Seriously, the only rule should be, that your player did something really cool plot wise and you shouldn't miss the chance to have it affect things later. There's no rule that says the response has to be immediate.
 
Last edited:

First, I'll echo the chorus in saying if you don't like DMing for evil characters then don't. As the DM you have full say on this matter; and you're part of the "everyone" that should be having fun.

I'm not sure if I feel the evil character actually did anything wrong. He was relaxing at a tavern when the paladin barged in, threw him on the table, and threatened him. The NE character defended himself. While the intentions of the paladin might have been Good, I do not believe they were Lawful. It seems to me that -by Law- the NE character was within his rights to defend himself.

Actions have consequences. In this case, the swordmage stabbed a paladin in the back in front of a room full of witnesses. There should be major consequences for such an act. Whether the swordmage did anything wrong is the secondary question here.



Sent from my SCH-I510 using Tapatalk
 

First, I'll echo the chorus in saying if you don't like DMing for evil characters then don't. As the DM you have full say on this matter; and you're part of the "everyone" that should be having fun.



Actions have consequences. In this case, the swordmage stabbed a paladin in the back in front of a room full of witnesses. There should be major consequences for such an act. Whether the swordmage did anything wrong is the secondary question here.



Sent from my SCH-I510 using Tapatalk

A lot of this is based on assumptions, but...

It seems to me that the Lawful Good organization the paladin worked for adheres to Law just as importantly as it does to Good. As such, they would be turning against their beliefs to not weigh the evidence.

Yes, the swordmage killed the paladin. However, he did so after the paladin provoked a fight. Yes, a room full of people witnessed the swordmage kill the paladin; however, the also witnessed the paladin barge in without provocation and attack the swordmage.
 

Into the Woods

Remove ads

Top