WotC How much does Hasbro / WotC impact your feelings towards D&D?

[MerricB]

It would be interesting to see how many of those of us who are frustrated with 5e and would prefer a greater revision of the game have played/focused more on the higher tier levels which require more DM tinkering of the game for it to work well.

I've now run two campaigns to 20th level, (plus a few DDAL Tier 4 scenarios) and I'm pretty happy with 5E.

My main problem with the last level 20 campaign - Sharpshooter - has been nerfed, so I'm a lot happier.

Cheers,
Merric

 

[Parmandur]

WotC especially gets criticized for every single thing they do because there are so many people who are mad that they want to play something other than DnD 5e (which is totally fine) but they can't find other players to play with since DnD 5e dominates the TTRPG player base.

Normally when people are overly dissatisfied with a company or a product, they just go have fun spending their time and money elsewhere on something they do like instead of spending their time being miserable and complaining about the thing they don't like. But when the company/product they're upset about is so dominant that it prevents them from exploring other options, you end up with people complaining constantly in hope they'll convince others to join their side

Which is ironic, because that tends to be more frustrating to people happy with the game than convincing of anything, and make alternatives less appealing.

 

[Hussar]

I'm going to say that there is a significant difference in tone between this:

But it's also a way more shallow game with the exciting angles filed off, developed to fit a broad commercial mass market to optimize profit.

and this:

What I have done on a few occasions is pointing out a few specific flaws, in my personal opinion, in 5e as reasons for me choosing other games.

Here's the dirty little secret. Those other companies that you buy RPG's from? They are in it to make money too. They are all about "optimizing profits". Virtually none of them are doing it because they happen to want to make you happy.

 

[Velderan]

Paizo is paying $43K/yr for the same job in the same city as WOTC is paying $150K a year.

That isn’t true. Paizo was offering $48k for a Starfinder designer position for someone with at least 2 published credits under their belt, which sounds pretty close to entry level to me. WotC was offering $88k-150k for a mid to senior level position. The Paizo position was also 100% remote so not the same city.

I don’t doubt WotC pays their designers better than Paizo or they wouldn’t have several former Paizo employees on their staff currently but let’s not pretend we know they all received $100k per year pay raises like you’re claiming.

 

[AnotherGuy]

Here's the dirty little secret. Those other companies that you buy RPG's from? They are in it to make money too. They are all about "optimizing profits". Virtually none of them are doing it because they happen to want to make you happy.

McDonalds is about maximising profit and their food is of a standard enough to satisfy the broad majority of customers, having evolved adequately over the years to retain their customer base. They are also located far and wide enough that everyone knows them and one can easily find a McDees within their area.
Your mom-and-pop diners are also trying to maximise profit true, but you get the feeling that perhaps there is a little more care in the finished product, generally speaking.

 

[Remathilis]

Maybe evergreen was the wrong word choice, but it was their word.

Basically, they made no fundamental, low-level changes to the game, and that's where the issue I have are. High level play. Number of encounters per day needed for class balance. Things like that.

They could. If they across the board halved the number of spell slots, and for some classes daily uses, they would be a lot closer on one of them.

But they didn't. They couldn't and have the "backward compatibility" as describing in the UA (which is more limited than the normal definition of backward compatibility).

Basically, I'm talking about how long before they start fresh and have a new RPG inspired by D&D that they wish to make the new brand lead, like happened from AD&D -> AD&D 2nd -> D&D 3ed -> 4e -> 5e.

Consider this.

D&D is a house WotC has lived in for the past 10 years. They have made it a home and added little things to it over the years, but now they want to tackle a major renovation project because the house isn't working for their needs as well as it used to.

They have two ways to do this:

1. Strip the house down, move a few walls and add an addition, and then redecorate with fresh paint and such

2. Knock the house down and build a new house using ideas of the old house in the new blueprints.

You're still going to have the same basics (bedrooms, living room, kitchen) but the first updates the basic structure of the old while the second is a fresh start from scratch. And where you fall on this Reno is dependent on what you feel about the old house and what needs changing. Some people are happy that the house isn't changing except for that weird closet being fixed and the new family room on the back. Others want a brand new house that better fits their evolving tastes and trends. (And a non zero number would be content to burn the shack to the ground and move to a different neighborhood).

The problem comes when (like an HGTV reality show) the people can't agree on which plan to do. Remodeling keeps the good parts but not every bad part can be fixed. A whole new home brings with it unforeseeable complications and a far greater cost. Neither is perfect.

 

[TiQuinn]

Consider this.

D&D is a house WotC has lived in for the past 10 years. They have made it a home and added little things to it over the years, but now they want to tackle a major renovation project because the house isn't working for their needs as well as it used to.

They have two ways to do this:

1. Strip the house down, move a few walls and add an addition, and then redecorate with fresh paint and such

2. Knock the house down and build a new house using ideas of the old house in the new blueprints.

You're still going to have the same basics (bedrooms, living room, kitchen) but the first updates the basic structure of the old while the second is a fresh start from scratch. And where you fall on this Reno is dependent on what you feel about the old house and what needs changing. Some people are happy that the house isn't changing except for that weird closet being fixed and the new family room on the back. Others want a brand new house that better fits their evolving tastes and trends. (And a non zero number would be content to burn the shack to the ground and move to a different neighborhood).

The problem comes when (like an HGTV reality show) the people can't agree on which plan to do. Remodeling keeps the good parts but not every bad part can be fixed. A whole new home brings with it unforeseeable complications and a far greater cost. Neither is perfect.

I’m sorry I don’t watch HGTV. Can you give me a helpful sports analogy?

 

[payn]

I’m sorry I don’t watch HGTV. Can you give me a helpful sports analogy?

Work free agency, or completely rebuild through the draft.

 

[TiQuinn]

Work free agency, or completely rebuild through the draft.

lol, that movie is such nonsense and yet I can’t not watch it when it’s on. It sucks me in every time.

 

[Hussar]

McDonalds is about maximising profit and their food is of a standard enough to satisfy the broad majority of customers, having evolved adequately over the years to retain their customer base. They are also located far and wide enough that everyone knows them and one can easily find a McDees within their area.
Your mom-and-pop diners are also trying to maximise profit true, but you get the feeling that perhaps there is a little more care in the finished product, generally speaking.

Your mom-and-pop restaurant (not going to talk about diners since most diners are such substandard quality that they barely count as food) are forced to go higher quality because they can't compete otherwise. Let's not pretend that they are doing higher quality out of the goodness of their hearts or out of some notion of "care". They are serving you the lowest quality, cheapest food they can get away with and still retain you as a customer. And, we go to that restaurant specifically because it is a higher quality than somewhere like McDonald's.

Again, this notion that only large corporations are about "maximizing profit" is a myth. And anyone who forgets that winds up out of business in fairly short order.