D&D 5E How specific is Commune with Nature?

[TaranTheWanderer]

You briefly become one with nature and gain knowledge of the surrounding territory. In the outdoors, the spell gives you knowledge of the land within 3 miles of you. In caves and other natural underground settings, the radius is limited to 300 feet. The spell doesn't function where nature has been replaced by construction, such as in dungeons and towns.

You instantly gain knowledge of up to three facts of your choice about any of the following subjects as they relate to the area:

• terrain and bodies of water
• prevalent plants, minerals, animals, or peoples
• powerful celestials, fey, fiends, elementals, or undead
• influence from other planes of existence
• buildings

For example, you could determine the location of powerful undead in the area, the location of major sources of safe drinking water, and the location of any nearby towns.

I'm more focusing on the word 'prevalent'.

Let's say, in a jungle area, there is a village of halflings. If you focus the spell around the village, the 'prevalent people' would be halfling?

If the Druid Leader of the tribe needs to locate a lost halfling child who has wandered out into the jungle, can you use commune with nature to find them or is it just going to tell me, "yeah, there are halflings in the area."

The spell seems to give detailed knowledge of whatever you're asking for. For example it says, "gain knowledge of Powerful Undead" and "Determine the location of powerful undead in the area". Which makes me think the spell would give me the location of the prevalent people (halfling, in this case) in the area. So, maybe the location of a village or concentration but, potentially, details on specific individuals - especially if they are the only 'person' within the area.

Or if the halfling has been kidnapped by humans, way out, away from the village of halflings, if the Druid were to cast the spell within range of the humans(some of the only 'peoples' in the area), will the spell only say, "the prevalent people's are human" or can I specify halflings?

 

[aco175]

I would think if you choose to use one of your 3 facts to key into the prevalent people in the area, you would know that a large group of halflings are to the north 2.2 miles. If you choose tour 2nd fact to ask about other groups of humanoids, then it becomes more of a DM interpretation. Does prevalent mean the largest source or just a good size of them? There could be a halfling community of 200 people and a goblin tribe of 50 and a moving band of 10 thugs with the halfling child all in the area.

Heck, with the new rules the word peoples could mean a lot of things now.

 

[Tonguez]

Prevalent means widespread in a particular area or at a particular time, predominant, powerful (archaic)

an individual cant be widespread or predominant, and a halfling isnt powerful ergo Commune with Nature cant locate an individual halfling. Just a big group of them, the question of how big is your DM call

 

[Stormonu]

Would it even tell you about the halfling village? The text you quoted states "The spell doesn't function where nature has been replaced by construction, such as in dungeons and towns". Would it see the village as a "hole" in the area?

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

Would it even tell you about the halfling village? The text you quoted states "The spell doesn't function where nature has been replaced by construction, such as in dungeons and towns". Would it see the village as a "hole" in the area?

It specifically lets you find towns since you can locate buildings I think it wouldn’t let you cast it while in a city.

The spell Even uses towns as an example of things you can find

 

[Tonguez]

It specifically lets you find towns since you can locate buildings I think it wouldn’t let you cast it while in a city.

The spell Even uses towns as an example of things you can find

The spell says it can identify buildings in otherwise natural areas - I assume it detects a rectangular gap or something. The Haflings probably do wander outside their town gates at times (perhaps farmers heading into the tobacco fields) so Nature would detect them at those times even if they sleep inside the burrows

 

[bloodtide]

The spell flat out says that it "doesn't function where nature has been replaced by construction, such as in dungeons and towns." A halfling village would be a place where "nature has been replaced by construction", so no information.
Commune with Nature, as written, won't help find a specific target.

Though this is a PERFECT example of the writers giving too much "help" as to what the spell does.
Try the 1E version: This spell enables the druid to become one with nature in the area, thus being empowered with knowledge of the surrounding territory. For each level of experience of the druid, he or she may "know" one fact, i.e. the ground ahead, left or right, the plants ahead, left or right, the minerals ahead, left or right, the water courses/bodies of water ahead, left or right, the people dwelling ahead, left or right, etc. The spell is effective only in outdoors settings, and operates in a radius of one half mile for each level of experience of the druid casting the Commune With Nature spell.

Of course 1E gives more "knows". But it's also vague. The 1E spell can pin point a person, object, thing.

The spell is high enough level that it should be useful.

 

[Hriston]

I'm more focusing on the word 'prevalent'.

Let's say, in a jungle area, there is a village of halflings. If you focus the spell around the village, the 'prevalent people' would be halfling?

If the Druid Leader of the tribe needs to locate a lost halfling child who has wandered out into the jungle, can you use commune with nature to find them or is it just going to tell me, "yeah, there are halflings in the area."

The spell seems to give detailed knowledge of whatever you're asking for. For example it says, "gain knowledge of Powerful Undead" and "Determine the location of powerful undead in the area". Which makes me think the spell would give me the location of the prevalent people (halfling, in this case) in the area. So, maybe the location of a village or concentration but, potentially, details on specific individuals - especially if they are the only 'person' within the area.

Or if the halfling has been kidnapped by humans, way out, away from the village of halflings, if the Druid were to cast the spell within range of the humans(some of the only 'peoples' in the area), will the spell only say, "the prevalent people's are human" or can I specify halflings?

The spell says "You instantly gain knowledge of up to three facts of your choice about [the prevalent peoples of the area (i.e. the halflings)]". You get to decide what facts those are. For example, one of those facts could be the location of the lost halfling.

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

The spell says "You instantly gain knowledge of up to three facts of your choice about [the prevalent peoples of the area (i.e. the halflings)]". You get to decide what facts those are. For example, one of those facts could be the location of the lost halfling.

When it says “up to three”, I read that, not as “3 facts about one of the subjects on the list” but as “facts about 3 things on the list”:

Facts about buildings
Facts about powerful undead
Facts about bodies of water

But my interpretation is derived from their example:

“For example, you could determine the location of powerful undead in the area, the location of major sources of safe drinking water, and the location of any nearby towns.”

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

The spell says it can identify buildings in otherwise natural areas - I assume it detects a rectangular gap or something. The Haflings probably do wander outside their town gates at times (perhaps farmers heading into the tobacco fields) so Nature would detect them at those times even if they sleep inside the burrows

I agree with you. I imagine that if you cast it in a jungle near a halfling village filled with grass huts built on the ground, the spell would detect the huts as blank spots where the spell doesn’t function (those are buildings) and the halflings living in and around the village would ping as the ‘people’ even if they were in the village. It wouldn’t detect halflings inside huts.

If it were a city with cobbled roads and almost no trees, I imagine the whole zone would stand out as a blank spot. So you could interpret that as a town.

 

[toucanbuzz]

If you focus the spell around the village, the 'prevalent people' would be halfling?

If the Druid Leader of the tribe needs to locate a lost halfling child who has wandered out into the jungle, can you use commune with nature to find them or is it just going to tell me, "yeah, there are halflings in the area."

Or if the halfling has been kidnapped by humans, way out, away from the village of halflings, if the Druid were to cast the spell within range of the humans(some of the only 'peoples' in the area), will the spell only say, "the prevalent people's are human" or can I specify halflings?

My group's 12th level druid routinely uses Commune with Nature, the capstone divination for his class. The information obtained strongly depends on the question asked. Ultimately, it cannot provide knowledge that nature wouldn't know. I like to provide information to players from the perspective of the elements or creatures therein, not just flat data. I also use the term "prevalent" to mean widespread/common, and the term "peoples" to common sense D&D purpose (e.g. player races, the type that use tools, speak common languages, live in communities).

Also, I watch for compound questions. The spell grants 3 facts, unlike other spells which grant a certain # of questions. One single question may exhaust the spell.

Jungle village of halflings. If you ask "what is the prevalent people" you might get a DM reply of: "The wind whips around you and a sweet smell of tabac smoke fills your nostrils reminding you of the Hin (halflings)." The DM does this because halflings are the most numerous folk in the range of the spell.

If you then ask "where do the Hin live" the DM might reply: "You are overwhelmed as for a moment you are simultaneously seeing through the eyes and ears of birds, crocodiles, snakes, and other creatures that have seen the Hin." The DM answered this way because the Hin forage and hunt, and thus they "live" everywhere for purposes of the spell. If the PC had asked "in what direction is the nearest Hin" you'd get a response for that current, exact moment in time.

If you instead asked "where is the nearest building to me with Hin" the DM should decide if this is a compound question. He knows the Hin are the prevalent people and the spell can give facts about them. He then might answer: "from the sky you swoop over the trees and spot a tiny plume of smoke from a massive tree with many branches. You bank on a slight wind and see the sun setting. Tabac smoke summoning the feeling of the Hin briefly fills your senses and the connection is broken. The wind shifts around you and pushes you to the north and west." The DM counts this as 2 facts because he's given a location + the Hin are the prevalent race. If the Hin were not the prevalent race, the spell might only give a building but the animal outside cannot tell anything about what made it. Also, the DM would have to determine if the building is something like a hunter's cabin (spell can give facts about) or an area replaced by construction such as a village (the spell fizzles and no fact is gained).

Specific creature. If a missing Hin child is captured by humans, the spell won't find a specific Hin because one "people" isn't at all common or widespread. However, this could be different if asking about powerful undead in the area as those register differently in the spell because of their unnatural nature, not their commonality to the region.

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

My group's 12th level druid routinely uses Commune with Nature, the capstone divination for his class. The information obtained strongly depends on the question asked. Ultimately, it cannot provide knowledge that nature wouldn't know. I like to provide information to players from the perspective of the elements or creatures therein, not just flat data. I also use the term "prevalent" to mean widespread/common, and the term "peoples" to common sense D&D purpose (e.g. player races, the type that use tools, speak common languages, live in communities).

Also, I watch for compound questions. The spell grants 3 facts, unlike other spells which grant a certain # of questions. One single question may exhaust the spell.

Jungle village of halflings. If you ask "what is the prevalent people" you might get a DM reply of: "The wind whips around you and a sweet smell of tabac smoke fills your nostrils reminding you of the Hin (halflings)." The DM does this because halflings are the most numerous folk in the range of the spell.

If you then ask "where do the Hin live" the DM might reply: "You are overwhelmed as for a moment you are simultaneously seeing through the eyes and ears of birds, crocodiles, snakes, and other creatures that have seen the Hin." The DM answered this way because the Hin forage and hunt, and thus they "live" everywhere for purposes of the spell. If the PC had asked "in what direction is the nearest Hin" you'd get a response for that current, exact moment in time.

If you instead asked "where is the nearest building to me with Hin" the DM should decide if this is a compound question. He knows the Hin are the prevalent people and the spell can give facts about them. He then might answer: "from the sky you swoop over the trees and spot a tiny plume of smoke from a massive tree with many branches. You bank on a slight wind and see the sun setting. Tabac smoke summoning the feeling of the Hin briefly fills your senses and the connection is broken. The wind shifts around you and pushes you to the north and west." The DM counts this as 2 facts because he's given a location + the Hin are the prevalent race. If the Hin were not the prevalent race, the spell might only give a building but the animal outside cannot tell anything about what made it. Also, the DM would have to determine if the building is something like a hunter's cabin (spell can give facts about) or an area replaced by construction such as a village (the spell fizzles and no fact is gained).

Specific creature. If a missing Hin child is captured by humans, the spell won't find a specific Hin because one "people" isn't at all common or widespread. However, this could be different if asking about powerful undead in the area as those register differently in the spell because of their unnatural nature, not their commonality to the region.

Very nice.

I’m playing a 10th level halfling Druid and wondering about how to use the spell. If a halfling hunting party goes missing, can I use commune with nature to find them or be forced to ‘hit the pavement’ and fly around using locate creature. Sure it’s useful to find powerful entities but I’m wondering about more mundane stuff

 

[Hriston]

When it says “up to three”, I read that, not as “3 facts about one of the subjects on the list” but as “facts about 3 things on the list”:

Facts about buildings
Facts about powerful undead
Facts about bodies of water

But my interpretation is derived from their example:

“For example, you could determine the location of powerful undead in the area, the location of major sources of safe drinking water, and the location of any nearby towns.”

Yeah, that's correct. It says "any of the following subjects" so it could be a different subject for each fact. Sorry for the inaccuracy of my parsing.

My point was that it's reasonable to say the location of the lost halfling is a fact about the halflings, but I suppose the spell could be interpreted to require the fact to be about the halflings in general, rather than about a specific individual.

 

[Umbran]

So, maybe the location of a village or concentration but, potentially, details on specific individuals - especially if they are the only 'person' within the area.

If you carefully choose the facts you get. Commune with Nature is a 5th level spell. Locate Creature is 4th. You can probably duplicate the latter with the former.

You only get three facts, so I don't think you'd get "detailed information" about the missing halfling and kidnappers.

 

[Tonguez]

If you carefully choose the facts you get. Commune with Nature is a 5th level spell. Locate Creature is 4th. You can probably duplicate the latter with the former..

The difference to my mind is that locate creature can be blocked by anti-scrying measures - nondetection etc, however when you’re communing with nature you’re not actually trying to detect a creature and thus cant be blocked.
but sure a well worded question might tell you enough to work it out

 

[Umbran]

The difference to my mind is that locate creature can be blocked by anti-scrying measures - nondetection etc, however when you’re communing with nature you’re not actually trying to detect a creature and thus cant be blocked.

With respect, you are actually trying to detect a creature. The claim that you aren't is belied by trying to ask how to narrow in on that one creature.

 

[Tonguez]

With respect, you are actually trying to detect a creature. The claim that you aren't is belied by trying to ask how to narrow in on that one creature.

Yeah as I said earlier I dont think the spell can detect/locate individuals, instead the druid is asking ‘Nature’ what are the things that are prevalent in that area - nature might tell me there are a lot of blueberries around, a thick stand of oak, some halflings near the river who disappear into a structure, a herd of deer and a wandering ghost.

Nature can not however tell me that Frodo is down by the river