How to avoid RPG dumpster fires like the Far Verona controversy

[Mort]

I don't deny that it might be possible to "trigger" someone at some point. But then again, I don't disagree that the real and more serious problem is that it was crass and distasteful. And so far as I can tell, no one was actually "triggered" by this incident - they found it crass and distasteful.

You're not correct. The statement put out by the player who was the target of the exchange shows the scene hit her VERY hard - not that it was just crass and distasteful.

 

[generic]

Does this type of situation occur often at the tables of others? I have never incorporated sexual violence into a single campaign, and neither have my DMs/GMs. Is this a normal thing?

 

[Umbran]

A big part of the problem is that there is a significant population of guys who read the above and roll their eyes.

No argument - those guys are part of the problem.

 

[Celebrim]

You're not correct. The statement put out by the player who was the target of the exchange shows the scene hit her VERY hard - not that it was just crass and distasteful.

I have watched her statement. And "hit her VERY hard" is not the same as being triggered. If a friend who I trusted got creepy with me and ruined a game I was enjoying, it would "hit me VERY hard". It would not "trigger" me. If my boss hit on me or sexually harassed me at work, it would be a very difficult and emotional experience. It would not "trigger" me.

 

[Celebrim]

Does this type of situation occur often at the tables of others? I have never incorporated sexual violence into a single campaign, and neither have my DMs/GMs. Is this a normal thing?

Guys creeping on pretty girls? Pretty common.

Actually incorporating sexual violence into a game? I would hope that it is rare, but there are a lot of high profile incidents.

 

[Mort]

I have watched her statement. And "hit her VERY hard" is not the same as being triggered. If a friend who I trusted got creepy with me and ruined a game I was enjoying, it would "hit me VERY hard". It would not "trigger" me. If my boss hit on me or sexually harassed me at work, it would be a very difficult and emotional experience. It would not "trigger" me.

sigh why on earth are you hair splitting to such an inane degree?

But since you insist:

The player in question was also a prior victim of sexual assault. This situation could have very easily acted as a trauma trigger for the prior occurrence and therefore fully qualifies in the clinical sense.

But wether this qualifies as an honest to got trigger? Who cares, the act/situation itself is more than enough of a problem on its own terms/merits. It needs to be highlighted to and pointed to as a prime example of what not to do in a game.

 

[Umbran]

Saying virtually anything becomes dangerous if you don't do it wisely or with precautions is a meaningless statement. Getting six of your buddies together to run through Castle Ravenloft, to troubleshoot for friend Computer, or prevent the Camarilla from sinking its fangs into your city is exceedingly unlikely to cause harm to any of the participants.

You are talking about what is "likely". As if you have a handle on what happens at hundreds of thousands of tables around the world? Care to tell us how you got this handle?

You say this, in a thread which starts with an example of harm. Kind of puts a hole in your position when it is right there.

How many women have to talk about sexual harassment at games before you consider it "likely" harm? Not that they are the only people who can be hurt, but it is the example the thread is about.

On the other hand, American football is an inherently dangerous activity where participants are commonly subjected to contusions or abrasions during the normal course of play.

In professional and college football, those guys are not at play. They are at work. Yes, there is risky work in the world.

In the video, the speaker mentions that play of RPGs involves making oneself vulnerable. He's entirely correct in that. And, by definition an activity in which one becomes vulnerable, one is at higher risk of harm, and so RPGs do have some inherent risk to them. It isn't risk of traumatic brain injury, but there's a lot of harm in the world that isn't about crushing bones.

 

[DammitVictor]

Does this type of situation occur often at the tables of others? I have never incorporated sexual violence into a single campaign, and neither have my DMs/GMs. Is this a normal thing?

It happened to me, once, thirty years ago. With the single dumbest DM I've ever had the displeasure of playing with.

I played with another DM who would have tried it on with me if he knew how badly it would have bothered me. Thankfully, I got sick of his crap before he escalated to a point that would have severe consequences for both of us.

 

[Umbran]

Adam's not any thing close to an idiot who burns money. This was planned and probably coordinated by the group.

Mod Note:

Your unfounded claim that folks were complicit in publicly staging an incident of harassment for profit is not acceptable. At all. You will not be posting in this thread again. Have us catch you making such a claim again, and you will not be posting on this site.

This is to make it 100% clear to everyone - groundless accusations that folks are fabricating rape, assault, or harrassment incidents will not be tolerated on this site.

 

[Guest 6801328]

I really have no desire to fight, but I think the whole "triggered" argument is mostly a strawman. Mostly, because sure, it does actually happen that some one has some sort of PTSD and can in fact be triggered in the clinical sense, but that mostly that word is appropriated to describe a wide range of much milder emotions with varying levels of discomfort and which even when great don't involve something that involves a clinical or medical condition. As such, use of the term is a sort of appropriation that ultimately detracts from the understanding of the real suffering of a very small percentage of people, while at the same time serving as a way to claim moral high ground on the issue in a lovely, "Shut up! How dare you!" sort of way.

And, as evidence of that, I'd like to point out that so far as I can tell no real triggering was involved in this controversy and it's dominance of the conversation while complete ignoring what actually happened here is well par for the course. And heck, "triggered" has become such a part of the vernacular now that it is used to refer to all sorts of things.

The players at the table found the whole situation awkward, distasteful, and unpleasant to the extent that GM lost, rightly I think, all the trust he had from his players. What he did was in a word, "creepy". That in itself is sufficient grounds to suggest it was wrong. There are lots of other ways in which I find it wrong, that I won't go into here. But what I didn't notice going on was anyone being "triggered".

If feel "triggered" has become the sort of thing that shows up for the same reason Godwin's Law has such predictive power. If it's the only thing in your toolbox for describing harm, then that's what you reach for. It doesn't actually reflect what is really going on 99.99% of the time. And for all those cases where harm happened but it wasn't a "triggering" event, it rather misses the point.

Deliberately sometimes.

I just typed a long response, but realized that if you haven't been persuaded by the very public debate, mostly in recent years, then I'm not going to accomplish anything with a forum post.