How to become a monster or just increase your size

[Tikanderoga]

Morning all

I got a Half Elf Druid 6/Warshaper 1/Master of Many Forms 9 character, and I am thinking about permanently increasing my size from medium to Huge - to qualify for some monstrous feats.

As a shapeshifter, I can turn into pretty much anything, so the standard disadvantages like "you don't fit in there" and "are you sure you want to enter the elven village as a troll" do not apply.

Now my big question is: How to achieve that?
A Wish spell is the most obvious choice, but what other ways are there?

 

[parinho7]

Permanency (Sor/Wiz 5) + Giant Size (Wu Jen 7)!

 

[Tikanderoga]

Permanency can be dispelled, which would disqualify me again
Besides: I cannot cast Wu Jen spells (Giant Size is Target Personal).
But the idea is good otherwise.

 

[Empirate]

Since you can turn into Huge sized monsters by now, and stay in whatever shape you wish more or less indefinitely (unless you choose to change shape again), I don't see a reason why you shouldn't be able to pick those monstrous feats right now. Of course, you disqualify yourself from using the feat whenever your current shape doesn't fulfill the feat's prerequisites - but as soon as you fulfill the prereqs again by taking a fitting shape, the feat's benefits "reactivate".

At least that's how I've always DMed it, and I'm sure quite a few DMs out there will let that pass. For example, I Druid I DMed for wanted Flyby Attack, which I granted, since she could assume the form of a flying animal whenever she wanted, and had some "training" and experience in using flying forms to be sure.

 

[Tikanderoga]

Since you can turn into Huge sized monsters by now, and stay in whatever shape you wish more or less indefinitely (unless you choose to change shape again), I don't see a reason why you shouldn't be able to pick those monstrous feats right now. Of course, you disqualify yourself from using the feat whenever your current shape doesn't fulfill the feat's prerequisites - but as soon as you fulfill the prereqs again by taking a fitting shape, the feat's benefits "reactivate".

At least that's how I've always DMed it, and I'm sure quite a few DMs out there will let that pass. For example, I Druid I DMed for wanted Flyby Attack, which I granted, since she could assume the form of a flying animal whenever she wanted, and had some "training" and experience in using flying forms to be sure.

My DM sees that differently:
I have to meet the prerequisites in my natural form. But tbh, I see things the same way as you do - feel free to take it, but you can only use it when you are in a form that meets the prerequisites.

 

[Empirate]

Maybe present the following argument to your DM to convince him:

So what's a Master of Many Forms' "natural form"? I thought the whole point of the class is to leave such concepts behind?
We Humans are born as infants, little more than vertebrate worms, incapable of sustaining our own life, and we die as decomposed husks possibly incapable of upright walk and sometimes even speech, but we live out a lot of our day as a bipedal, visually acute, manually dextrous race - so what's the "natural form" of a Human? Druids, in D&D, stretch the boundaries further, by first discovering their inner animal, and later connecting to plants and even primal, elemental forces. They can also physically change to look like whatever member of their race they choose. Masters of Many Forms, taking the concept a step further, finally leave all restrictions of outward form or size behind, being (as in, physically) whatever they feel like (as in, mentally).

Really, with your ability to remain in whatever form for 15 hours in a stretch, AND the ability to take any form you like 11 times/day, there's no reason why any one form should be more "natural" to you than any other.

If the DM tries to trump this with the "revert after dying" argument, tell him that you a) don't intend to die, and b) so the human shape's a natural form for a dead body - but it is NOT a natural form for your living body, which has gotten rid of the concept some levels ago!

 

[Tikanderoga]

Maybe present the following argument to your DM to convince him:

So what's a Master of Many Forms' "natural form"? I thought the whole point of the class is to leave such concepts behind?
We Humans are born as infants, little more than vertebrate worms, incapable of sustaining our own life, and we die as decomposed husks possibly incapable of upright walk and sometimes even speech, but we live out a lot of our day as a bipedal, visually acute, manually dextrous race - so what's the "natural form" of a Human? Druids, in D&D, stretch the boundaries further, by first discovering their inner animal, and later connecting to plants and even primal, elemental forces. They can also physically change to look like whatever member of their race they choose. Masters of Many Forms, taking the concept a step further, finally leave all restrictions of outward form or size behind, being (as in, physically) whatever they feel like (as in, mentally).

Really, with your ability to remain in whatever form for 15 hours in a stretch, AND the ability to take any form you like 11 times/day, there's no reason why any one form should be more "natural" to you than any other.

If the DM tries to trump this with the "revert after dying" argument, tell him that you a) don't intend to die, and b) so the human shape's a natural form for a dead body - but it is NOT a natural form for your living body, which has gotten rid of the concept some levels ago!

LOVE IT!
I'll let you know what he says to that.

 

[Tikanderoga]

Since you can turn into Huge sized monsters by now, and stay in whatever shape you wish more or less indefinitely (unless you choose to change shape again), I don't see a reason why you shouldn't be able to pick those monstrous feats right now. Of course, you disqualify yourself from using the feat whenever your current shape doesn't fulfill the feat's prerequisites - but as soon as you fulfill the prereqs again by taking a fitting shape, the feat's benefits "reactivate".

At least that's how I've always DMed it, and I'm sure quite a few DMs out there will let that pass. For example, I Druid I DMed for wanted Flyby Attack, which I granted, since she could assume the form of a flying animal whenever she wanted, and had some "training" and experience in using flying forms to be sure.

I spoke to my DM and we pretty much settled on the above rule.
Since I already got "assume SU (Antimagic Cone)" for the beholder form, this set pretty much the precedence for any further feats like these, as it is only available when I am in a Beholder form. So things like Snatch or Fling Enemy will be available once I reach MMF10.

 

[Empirate]

Excellent, congratz on having a reasonable DM! Enjoy your MoMF!