How to handle checks that just HAVE to succeed?

[VGer]

The next adventure is supposed to start with the delivery of a ransom payment and then following the Bad Guys to the hideout. But then I started thinking: "What if they fail the track check?"

If they do fail, then it's the end of the adventure. If I fudge, it doesn't feel right.

This has happened in the past, in published adventures, with secret doors that have to be found in order to continue the adventure. Roll, roll, roll. "Ok, you found a secret door". Player looks at me and says "Great. Otherwise it would be the end of the adventure, right? <blink>"

Help. I don't know how to make them succeed and not to appear as if the check didn't matter.

Otherwise I fear that my players will start asking themselves: "why should I spend a feat in Track if the DM will make sure we succeed in order to continue the adventure?"

 

[Terraism]

One method is to have enough background that, even if the PC's don't manage to track the villain, there are other things they can do during the session. And then they'll have to deal with the consequences of their failure at a later time. Or, to keep it moving quicker, plan ahead what the results of failure will be, and if they do fail, just skip ahead to that point.

 

[hong]

The next adventure is supposed to start with the delivery of a ransom payment and then following the Bad Guys to the hideout. But then I started thinking: "What if they fail the track check?"

If they do fail, then it's the end of the adventure. If I fudge, it doesn't feel right.

This has happened in the past, in published adventures, with secret doors that have to be found in order to continue the adventure. Roll, roll, roll. "Ok, you found a secret door". Player looks at me and says "Great. Otherwise it would be the end of the adventure, right? <blink>"

Help. I don't know how to make them succeed and not to appear as if the check didn't matter.

Otherwise I fear that my players will start asking themselves: "why should I spend a feat in Track if the DM will make sure we succeed in order to continue the adventure?"

1. Use take 10, and make sure the DC is low enough that the party ranger will succeed.

2. Have the bad guys detect that someone is following them, and lay an ambush. The PCs either blunder into the ambush or detect it, but either way there's a fight. Let them capture a prisoner to interrogate.

3. Locate object spell. Either a PC can cast it, or they can find someone to cast it for them.

 

[Cassander]

You can make retries on Tracking checks.... once each hour outdoors, as I recall. So they can keep searching until they get it right... perhaps taking too long will result in some disadvantage when they reach the fort, but they'll make it.

If it's a time thing (they have to get there in a certain amount of time), then either use take 10 (as was suggested earlier) or simply roll the check yourself and let it succeed.

Same goes for secret doors, really, which are easier since the DM will always be making the search checks for those.

 

[Pielorinho]

Ideally, there should be several paths the players can take: you want to avoid this sort of bottleneck.

In your example, a gather information check could suffice to find the bad guy's lair. And if none of the PCs have the skill -- well, remember that gold and ale can loosen lips and grant circumstance bonuses to the roll. If they fail on the track check, it'll cost them money and time, but they can still go forward.

For a secret door, if they don't notice it right away, then either skip over it (meaning that they don't go to that part of the adventure), or have them chase down a bad guy who uses the secret door, or something similar. WOrk it into the story.

Daniel

 

[Terraism]

For a secret door, if they don't notice it right away, then either skip over it (meaning that they don't go to that part of the adventure), or have them chase down a bad guy who uses the secret door, or something similar. WOrk it into the story.

There's also the fact that, because secret doors are around, and adventurers know that, if they come to a dead end when they know that there has to be more there, they'll eventually take 20 on the searching. If they can't find it when they're taking twenty, then there's a problem.

 

[WayneLigon]

For tracking, nothing beats having a dog as a companion And not even as an Animal Companion, but just as a normal dog you've trained up.

 

[Sir Whiskers]

To me, this is a bit too close to "railroading" (allowing the players only one correct course of action). Instead, consider adding two or three alternatives that could work. Examples:

1. One of the bandits sees an opportunity to make some money for himself and approaches the party, offering to sell them information. He may even be planning to trick them into an ambush, one which the party may avoid if they're careful.

2. Unbeknownst to the party, the victim's family and/or friends have paid a mage to cast divinations (locate object, clairvoyance, etc.), which have revealed clues to the location of the hideout.

3. Did anyone capture one of the kidnappers during the crime? If so, perhaps he can be interrogated. If no one has a clue who the kidnappers are, perhaps one or more is in town, keeping an eye on things and reporting back periodically. If the party catches on, they have a number of options (attempt to follow the spies, try to capture and "turn" them, have the party rogue attempt to join them, etc).

4. If the bandits have struck before in this area, perhaps the authorities have some information from earlier investigations. The party might gain the name of a suspected member, or the constable might be able to lead the party to where the trail ran out when tracking the bandits for their earlier crime. Perhaps the constable or one of his men is in on it, and a properly suspicious party can gain follow/capture him for more info.

 

[TeeSeeJay]

To me, this is a bit too close to "railroading" (allowing the players only one correct course of action). Instead, consider adding two or three alternatives that could work. Examples:

1. One of the bandits sees an opportunity to make some money for himself and approaches the party, offering to sell them information. He may even be planning to trick them into an ambush, one which the party may avoid if they're careful.

2. Unbeknownst to the party, the victim's family and/or friends have paid a mage to cast divinations (locate object, clairvoyance, etc.), which have revealed clues to the location of the hideout.

3. Did anyone capture one of the kidnappers during the crime? If so, perhaps he can be interrogated. If no one has a clue who the kidnappers are, perhaps one or more is in town, keeping an eye on things and reporting back periodically. If the party catches on, they have a number of options (attempt to follow the spies, try to capture and "turn" them, have the party rogue attempt to join them, etc).

4. If the bandits have struck before in this area, perhaps the authorities have some information from earlier investigations. The party might gain the name of a suspected member, or the constable might be able to lead the party to where the trail ran out when tracking the bandits for their earlier crime. Perhaps the constable or one of his men is in on it, and a properly suspicious party can gain follow/capture him for more info.

I concur. Always have multiple paths through the adventure.

If the player's fail the track check, be sure there's a longer, more difficult method for them to find the hideout. I usually make a flowchart for the adventures I run, so that there's no single point of failure.

 

[Darius101]

I feel like rainman ......yeah yeah always multiple paths always multiple paths.

Or use something to drive them in the direction you want them to go. Not railroad them but raise the curiosity level in some way so that they will go that direction. If they bite they bite if they don't then you need to plan for that too.
I like the go to the authorities ...maybe the authorites in the city are on the payroll eh? Or the players are wanted for something else but can get off the hook if they go talk to such and such and boom your back into the adventure.

An Adventure should never hinge on one single door...that if they players miss they game will end right then and there.

Just my 2cp,
Darius