How to Solve the Fighter/Psion...suggestions welcome!

[moritheil]

Have an opponent power attack for full as the second attack in the round and they will be hurting.

I cringe a bit when someone's reflexive answer is golems, though Arabesu does have a point. Personally, before resorting to that, I'd just have someone hit the Elan with a couple of (or one Sudden Maximized) enervations during the first fight of the day, and timing the remaining encounters so that the Elan gets to suffer through the other fights that day.

I should point out that the Elan was said to have a high AC for its level, so you might not want to full power attack . . .

 

[Haffrung Helleyes]

I would never allow an Elan in my game. Whoever designed that race was on crack.

Ken

 

[Piratecat]

I'll take the other extreme. The tradeoff on the elan pp/damage mitigation is horrible, and gets less useful as the PC rises in levels. It's a nice thing to have, but I just don't find it too powerful. It's also only usable once a round if I remember correctly; multiple damage sources are still a threat. I find the dwarf and the human to be more powerful races.

Other good tactics for threatening the character Arabesu has already mentioned: poison, mind affecting spells (yay, charm person!), and the like.

 

[KarinsDad]

I'll take the other extreme. The tradeoff on the elan pp/damage mitigation is horrible, and gets less useful as the PC rises in levels. It's a nice thing to have, but I just don't find it too powerful. It's also only usable once a round if I remember correctly; multiple damage sources are still a threat. I find the dwarf and the human to be more powerful races.

What Resistance and Resilience tend to do (combined with Vigor) is prevent the Elan from almost ever going unconscious or being taken out by a mentally affecting spell/power except at the very lowest of levels. Some skill points and a single feat for humans comes nowhere near that level of control. And sure, saving these abilities for the right time prevents the Psion from using other Quickened abilities at mid to high level, but Schism at level 7 (or 9) mostly takes care of that issue.

The Elan Psion I played only went unconscious once in 9 levels and that was at 3rd level in a battle which could have been a TPK (the DM had enemies using missile fire from above in the dark so that the PCs could not target the NPCs back and we could not leave because it took too long to drag unconscious PCs out of bow range) except the DM realized that he screwed up, so he ended up having the bad guys parley with us. She went unconscious because she was the only one who managed to get up and fight them on their ledge and so, she was being attacked by 6 NPCs all at once. When she ran out of PP and nearly out of hit points, she jumped off the ledge (where she went unconscious) so that the Paladin could heal her.

Actual playing experience has shown me of no other class/race combo in the game that is so capable of staying conscious and hence, staying alive. There might be one, but I am unaware of what combo that might be.

You are correct that multiple attacks per round can defeat this, but Vigor handles the vast majority of physical attacks and there are many defensive powers that can handle the brunt of the spell/power attacks. Also, if the DM is specifically targeting any PC with multiple spell attacks per round, then it really does not matter what abilities the PC has, sooner or later the PC will fall because sooner or later, the player will roll one or more ones on saves.

 

[DM_Matt]

Other good tactics for threatening the character Arabesu has already mentioned: poison, mind affecting spells (yay, charm person!), and the like.

Alas, Elans are abberations, and thus immune to Charm/Dominate/Hold/Reduce/etc. Person, requiring the much higher-level monster versions. That and in those cases as well as with poison they can boost their saves rather than buffer against damage.

 

[KarinsDad]

Alas, Elans are abberations, and thus immune to Charm/Dominate/Hold/Reduce/etc. Person, requiring the much higher-level monster versions.

A player of an Elan should be sure to remind his DM of this every once in a while since a humanoid mind affecting spell should not even target the Elan. The spell just plain fails. So instead of the DM saying "Roll a saving throw", the DM should instead say "The creature casts a spell, but nothing seems to happen.".

 

[Piratecat]

Ha! Excellent points. I had taken KD's points into account when I posted, but forgot about aberrations - and I haven't played one to 9 levels, which KD has. I've only used them as NPCs, and that's not the same thing at all.

I may house rule these guys to +1 ECL after reading this thread.

 

[Dr_Rictus]

I'd only add that I don't actually read this as an issue with the fighter/psion build. A psion who doesn't care about his ACP-based skills and his ray attacks can wear all the plate mail he wants already with no consequences, without losing what could have been another psion level.

 

[KarinsDad]

I'd only add that I don't actually read this as an issue with the fighter/psion build. A psion who doesn't care about his ACP-based skills and his ray attacks can wear all the plate mail he wants already with no consequences, without losing what could have been another psion level.

That's a difficult Psion to play since such a character would rely solely on his powers. Using powers most rounds means quickly running out of PP in one or two battles, especially at low to mid levels. This also means that the Psion has no back up combat abilities once he runs out of PP.

Even a low level Wizard out of spells can still use a light crossbow. A low level Psion in plate mail out of PP cannot even semi-effectively use any weapons because he would be at -4 to all attacks.

The two ways to resolve this are Inertial Armor or a level of a class (like Fighter) with armor proficiencies. Both of these remove the -4 penalty and allow a Psion to fight with weapons when s/he does not want to use up PP.

 

[KarinsDad]

I may house rule these guys to +1 ECL after reading this thread.

I concur. I house ruled out quite a few classes and all +X ECL races in my campaign, but I only house ruled out one +0 ECL race: Elans.

PS. Elans are actually quite wimpy if they do not take any psionic classes with PP. It's just increasing their PP that makes for a more powerful combo.