How to use Graz'zt as BBEG

[Obergnom]

You mean this?

Yes. I like it a lot. And the 4e Graz'zt is medium sizi, should be a perfect fit.

One of the wonderful things about Graz'zt is that he's sneaky and devious.

Quite literally, you could make him behind anything. Just come up with a plotline, maybe toss in an anomaly or two, and the PCs never even need to know he was involved.

Heck, you can even retroactively change previous adventures, and make it so he had a hand in them, too.

Yes, but that does not really make the players 'hate' him. What I miss is themes to explore to tie adventures to him (like Orcus - Undead, Demogorgon - Savage Beasts)

 

[Desdichado]

Below the Ampersand Article

Ampersand: What Happens in Vegas ...

Huh. I get a server error.

 

[(un)reason]

Yes, but that does not really make the players 'hate' him. What I miss is themes to explore to tie adventures to him (like Orcus - Undead, Demogorgon - Savage Beasts)

I can think of one. Remember, one of Grazzt's schticks is that he is incredibly sexy, and enjoys exploiting it. This is not only irritating to players, but gives you an easy in to the life of any character who isn't a total loner badass. Having your sister/wife/mum/whatever significant NPC turning out to be pregnant and giving birth to a half demon is not going to make them happy. Bonus points if the baby then grows to maturity fast enough to become a mid-upper level nemesis before you actually get to encounter Grazzt. Double bonus if they're still in love with him despite being obviously exploited and all the personal "girls prefer bad boys" crap you can hit your players with relating to it.

Of course, exploiting the sexual insecurities of the players as a way of getting them invested in the game may backfire if done badly. You'll have to decide if you're willing to take that risk.

 

[Shemeska]

Not restricting what demons are or aren't supposed to act like, I'd be very tempted to play with some thematic parallels between Graz'zt and Pale Night and the Lovecraftian Nyarlathotep and Shub-Niggurath (because the Dark Man and the Mother of Demons fall into those roles ever so nicely...).

 

[Zanticor]

Graz'zt, my friends, is behind everything. Especially everything concerning the pc´s. Why do you think a PC can grow in strength from a lonely peasant to a plane sailing hero within the space of just one month? Why does he always meet level appropriate encounters and no more then four a day? Why are they always railroaded to the most interessting things to happen in ages? Graz'zt fuels their process. Never mind they are god loving goody good guys. Those are the ones he likes to use the most! If they get angry with him for this when they finaly findout. Let them go bring some chaos in the abys. Graz'zt will be giggling behind his DM screen.

Zanticor

 

[Snoweel]

Grazz´t, my friends, is behind everything. Especially everything concerning the pc´s. Why do you think a PC can grow in strength from a lonely peasant to a plane sailing hero within the space of just one month? Why does he always meet level appropriate encounters and no more then four a day? Why are they always railroaded to the most interessting things to happen in ages? Grazz´t fuels their process. Never mind they are god loving goody good guys. Those are the ones he likes to use the most! If they get angry with him for this when they finaly findout. Let them go bring some chaos in the abys. Grazz´t will be giggling behind his DM screen.

Zanticor

Heh

 

[El Mahdi]

I can think of one. Remember, one of Grazzt's schticks is that he is incredibly sexy, and enjoys exploiting it. This is not only irritating to players, but gives you an easy in to the life of any character who isn't a total loner badass. Having your sister/wife/mum/whatever significant NPC turning out to be pregnant and giving birth to a half demon is not going to make them happy. Bonus points if the baby then grows to maturity fast enough to become a mid-upper level nemesis before you actually get to encounter Grazzt. Double bonus if they're still in love with him despite being obviously exploited and all the personal "girls prefer bad boys" crap you can hit your players with relating to it.

Of course, exploiting the sexual insecurities of the players as a way of getting them invested in the game may backfire if done badly. You'll have to decide if you're willing to take that risk.

...emphasis mine


Yeah, you have to try and resist making a lot of bow-chicka-bow-wow sounds.

Also, don't have him walking around like Donkey in Shrek saying "I'm Sexy!".

 

[Afton Radav]

Graz'zt, by Sepulchrave

After re-reading Sepulchrave's tales of Wyre, I cannot think of Graz'zt and his machinations any better way (although he does not show up in person until halfway through).

http://www.enworld.org/forum/story-hour/58227-tales-wyre-09-23-08-update.html

 

[Lurks-no-More]

I can think of one. Remember, one of Grazzt's schticks is that he is incredibly sexy, and enjoys exploiting it.

To expand a bit on this... Orcus is all about death and undeath, and embracing the latter to overcome the former; Demogorgon, about madness and frothing chaos where the left hand not only doesn't know what the right hand is doing, but actively working against it; and Yeenoghu represents murderous, manic bloodlust and gibbering cannibalism.

Graz'zt... he's evil with style. He's all about the seductive quality of evil, the idea that the bad boys have more fun and get the girls, that morals and qualms and codes and bargains just get in the way of being an awesome, magnificent bastard.

And he must be a horrible bastard. He's a former archdevil setting himself up as a ruler of demons; Graz'zt should be wicked and horrifying, so that the PCs will be hating him even as they envy his diabolic pomp and demonic splendor.

 

[Obergnom]

Hmm, maybe it would be good to find a couple of monsters to properly theme Graz'zt. To me, Demogorgon is all about fiendish apes and Orcus is rather uninteresting without his undead. These monsters could be used during the whole campaign and the players will start to connect their actions to Graz'zt, hopefully starting to hate him.

His major servitors are mostly gone, with the 4e change to lamias, thats definately a problem. So, all there is, he preferes the beautiful and the subtle ones. Most of these creatures are now considered fey...

Fitting entries in the 4e Monster Manual

Cambion; Demon: Glabrezu?, Marilith, Vrock; Rogue Devil: Kyton, Imp, Succubus; Rakshasa, Tiefling
Adding fiendish Fey: Lamia, Harpy, Hag

not that many... I guess I need to look up monsters in olders manuals...