How will 4th ed. affect other d20-based games?

[Scribble]

Why should they be affected? It's not like the 4e gestapo are going to show up at your house and take away your 3.0/3.5e materials. It's also not like the OGL and d20 SRD are going to go away.

Obviously, for D&D settings, there will be repercussions, but that's a consequence of tying your IP into the game. Folks who did their own systems shouldn't be affected much at all.

Contrary to popular belief, the sky is not falling.

--G

Hrmm I don't think the OP was trying to indicate any sort of imminent doom...

These games are based of off the core d20 idea. If they change the core d20 idea, and those changes prove popular, I'm guessing there will be changes to these games to reflect the changes to the d20 core. (Maybe not word for word, but in the same fashion they're based off of the core now...)

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I guess some d20 or OGL companies that work strongly off of the 3.x core rulebooks will look at creating a 4th edition compatible version. This might lead to a more fractured player base, since some will want to stay with the old. But if D&D 4th edition can survive such fracturing (because it also gets new players), this might work out equally well for 3rd party supplements.

Iron Heroes or Arcana Evolved (speaking of systems I know and care about the most) might benefit from such a "redo", too, but I am not sure if the current owners of the system (I believe Monte has given most of the rights to other companies since he is pursuing his novelist career) will or want to pull that off.

From what I heard about it, a game like M&M or True20 might not be affected much, since they probably retain as much from the 3rd edition mechanic then D&D 4 does (even if with a slightly different subset).

 

[Treebore]

Mutants and MAsterminds, True 20, etc... will stick around as long as a fan base dose.

As for Mongoose, I expect them to realign their products to their in house systems, such as Runequest and Traveller.

The rest depends on the consumer.

 

[GAAAHHH]

If I remember correctly, Mongoose people said that Conan was definitely not going to be changed to 4th edition rules (they just released a 2nd edition Conan). Having RuneQuest and Traveller, I seriously doubt they will release any more d20 stuff.

Green Ronin has True20, and Mutants and Masterminds. Neither of them are getting changed. Pirates Guide to Freeport is systemless, but they are going to have a 4th edition book or PDF for it. They may have some 4th edition adventures, but we'll see.

Castles and Crusades isn't getting changed, according to questions on the Troll Lords messageboard.

Paizo is very likely to release 4th edition, but they are hedging their bets and waiting to see the system first. Necromancer Games and Goodman Games have both said that they are definitely going to use 4th edition for their adventures.

I don't think Kenzer and Company are using any more d20 (they have a new version of Hackmaster coming along).

That's all I can think of, right now. If any of this is wrong, don't blame me, I just follow talk on the messageboards. Someone with the appropriate companies can correct me.

 

[Ranger REG]

I was thinking about Mutants & Masterminds last night -- I let my copy go many months back but now I've got a hankering for superhero fun again -- and it hit me that with several aspects of d20 D&D coming out, other related games might be affected as well.

Any ideas on that? Are those games tweaked so much already that they won't really be hit by 4th edition?

AFAIC, MnM rules branched off from the d20 SRD root.

It's still familiar yet very different. It is its own ruleset.

4e may change in terms of some game mechanics that gamers would like to port over to MnM rules. I'd like to say with certainty that when 4e SRD is out, that it would give Steve Kenson and Green Ronin the option to use a handful of new OGC to improve the MnM rules, or give us a book on how to use new mechanics since many of us don't play with the MnM rules "as is."

 

[coyote6]

4e may change in terms of some game mechanics that gamers would like to port over to MnM rules. I'd like to say with certainty that when 4e SRD is out, that it would give Steve Kenson and Green Ronin the option to use a handful of new OGC to improve the MnM rules, or give us a book on how to use new mechanics since many of us don't play with the MnM rules "as is."

A Mastermind's Manual II might be viable. And I'm sure if/when GR decides it's time for a third edition of M&M, they'd consider any really useful changes.

However, of the changes we've seen hinted at so far, about the only ones that are interest to me in terms of M&M is perhaps whatever they do with the grappling and size rules.

The changes to saves might be viable as an option -- of course, that would change one of the big innovations of M&M (and True20): the Toughness save. So they might not want to change it; but it would be a great option for a Mastermind's Manual II (and is similar to options already in MaMa).

The skill system changes don't seem to be a real good fit for M&M, from what's been alluded to so far; they might work well with True20, but M&M's Power Level isn't the same as D&D's levels; characters aren't expected to go from PL 1 to PL 20 (or even PL 10 to 20) the same way D&D characters are expected to go from 1st level to 20th or 30th level. It would suck for a starting M&M character to be stuck at the same skill levels forever, until they get more capable of blowing stuff up.

The rest of the 4e changes so far are either specific to D&D's setting and schtick (points of light, planar arrangements, monsters), tied to D&D's classes -- neither of which are relevant to M&M -- or involve rules M&M already changed or ignored (hit points, attacks of opportunity, etc.).

 

[Keeper of Secrets]

I am fairly certain I saw something where GR said M&M would not be updating in the near future.

 

[Psion]

Close derivatives might be affected.

Systems that already have their own solutions to weaknesses in the d20 SRD (like M&M and Spycraft) I don't think will be affected at all. (In fact, I don't think Spycraft 2.0 even sites the 3.5 or modern SRD).

 

[Mark Plemmons]

I don't think Kenzer and Company are using any more d20 (they have a new version of Hackmaster coming along).

You're right - we've got a new edition of HackMaster planned for a couple of years down the road. Settings and supplements will be as rules-free as possible, so they can be used for any system.

In the meantime, we may do some 3.5 or 4.0 stuff, but it's probably just going to be new PDF/Print On Demand releases or updates. I suspect several other companies will also decide to use their own system than be shackled to one that will probably get a 'reboot' every 2-3 years.

 

[Piratecat]

Why should they be affected? It's not like the 4e gestapo are going to show up at your house and take away your 3.0/3.5e materials. It's also not like the OGL and d20 SRD are going to go away.

Obviously, for D&D settings, there will be repercussions, but that's a consequence of tying your IP into the game. Folks who did their own systems shouldn't be affected much at all.

Contrary to popular belief, the sky is not falling.

--G

Did he say the sky was falling? He did not. There's no need to respond with such a hostile and patronizing tone.

Seriously, folks. don't look for offense where none is intended, and please don't be aggressive towards people just because they ask a question. It comes off as really irritable and unfriendly, even when that's not what you intend.

Thanks.