D&D 5E How would you balance this modification to spellcasters?

[Blue]

Okay, just thinking about this in the abstract:

If casters still have a large number of slots, they have both nova and staying power. I would need to greatly reduce the number of available slots. Like the caster vs. warlock, it's nova vs. recharge. Say one per spell level and eventually getting a second.

That will weaken some low level utility spells like Shield that expect to be able to be used several times in a short period. It will strengthen other spells that are good to cast several times per day but not close to each other (anything with 1+ hr duration, many out-of-combat spells, etc.).

On top of that, we need to nerf spells in order to keep caster vs. non-caster balance. To look at just combat, over the course of a day a caster spending action to do damage should max at non-casters spending actions to do damage. (I mention "max" because casters also have flexibility to do control, buffs, debuffs, etc.) When you get 2nd level spells, you're already up to 1 per short rest. When you get 3rd level spells you're up to 3 prof so that is also 1 per short rest. That's a lot more powerful. So we need to nerf the spells as well. Especially at high levels when you can go through two combats (an average between short rests to recharge) without ever needing to use cantrips. And remmeber, you still get the same number of high level spells per day as a PHB caster.

Oh, and remove the Arcane recharge and like (druid, etc.).

Changing topics some, this is a lot more powerful for half casters as presented - they get the same number of spell slot refreshes as full casters. I'd suggest changing it the short-rest refresh to half proficiency for half casters as well as EK/AT. Not that the paladin specifically gets changed in feel - they can't nova Divine Smite as needed (because of reduced slots), but they have reliably recharge over the course of the day.

Next topic - if the players control the pace of the adventuring day, I can see a lot more short rests happening. That's somethign that needs to be discussed int he context of a specific table. (Note that reduced spell slots per level helps avoid taking several back-to-back short rests).

Summary:

• Only 1 slot per spell lavel (with a few more low level slots at high caster level)
• Spells recharging this fast plus base spells per day allows more actions spent casting powerful spells, so spells need to be nerfed as well.
• Remove other slot recharge mechanics.
• Change partial casters to recharging based on 1/2 Proficiency on short rests.
• Changes play style of casters as well as some like paladin.
• Table-dependant - how frequent short rests. This assumes one every other meaningful encounter.

 

[Li Shenron]

After a Short Rest all spellcasters refresh one spellcasting slot of each level per level up to their Proficiency Bonus (so someone with a PB of 6 refreshes one each of levels 1-6). After a Long Rest all casters refresh one spellcasting slot of each level they can cast.

I'm aware that some spellcasters don't get the highest level slots. Tough.

How would you balance that?

It's very difficult... on one hand, the short rest refresh means potentially a LOT of more spells cast each day, on the other hand, the long rest refreshes much LESS than the standard. But the latter drawback can be almost* nullified, if the DM allows the PCs to also get a few short rests after the long rest (as in: sleep 8 hours to get a long rest, then do some moderate activity followed by a short rest 3 times, and you get all the daily slots back). It's a bit subjective whether a DM would allow something like that or not...

*almost, because at levels 19-20 there will be a 6th-level slot and a 7th-level slot that could still be left not recharged

In general, it looks a HUGE BOOST to spellcasters: three short rests per day (which I guess is quite normal) equal doubling the number of spells per day being cast (except the highest levels).

If you meant to balance this change with another change on the same character, something needs to be taken away but I can't think of anything right now, especially because Wizards and Sorcerers have very little beyond their spells in terms of class features.

If you want to balance the rest of the characters i.e. boost the others, you would probably need to almost double their daily resources (excluding HP)... the problem is that only spellcasters have so much daily resources, while the others have more at-will or short-rest-recharged resources.

So perhaps instead of more changes to the classes, you might actually just want to make everyone's day longer, so that daily resources become less important than the others. Obviously by "make the day longer" I don't mean just double the hours but try to double the number of encounters. You then might have a problem left with everyone's HP however...

 

[Chase Skylark]

After a Short Rest all spellcasters refresh one spellcasting slot of each level per level up to their Proficiency Bonus (so someone with a PB of 6 refreshes one each of levels 1-6). After a Long Rest all casters refresh one spellcasting slot of each level they can cast.

I'm aware that some spellcasters don't get the highest level slots. Tough.

How would you balance that?

So... All I can figure out is that you're playing Gritty Realism rules with a need for spell slots to Regen easier? Cause otherwise there is no balance. Call all spells "at-will powers" and call it a day

 

[Quartz]

It's very difficult...

Precisely.

In general, it looks a HUGE BOOST to spellcasters: three short rests per day (which I guess is quite normal) equal doubling the number of spells per day being cast (except the highest levels).

Well, there are supposed to be 2-3 short rests per day.

If you meant to balance this change with another change on the same character, something needs to be taken away but I can't think of anything right now, especially because Wizards and Sorcerers have very little beyond their spells in terms of class features.

Don't forget Clerics and Druids and Bards. How about reducing the number of casting slots? Not quite as far as the Warlock because the Warlock gets other bennies.

 

[the Jester]

I wouldn't. I wouldn't use that variant; it doesn't fix anything that needs fixing, in my judgment, and I'm not a fan of change for the sake of change.

 

[cbwjm]

The more I think of this as a variant, the more I like it. It can lead to a caster waking up the next day having only a single spell slot of each level due to completely expending resources the day before but then still able to get a few more slots back during short rests. A caster is likely to be front loaded with spells at the start of the adventure, but if the adventure takes a few days, they may find that they have limited resources towards the end unless they hoard spell slots specifically for the end boss encounter.

Higher level spells are still going to be limited since the highest spell level that can be recharged during a short rest is 6th level (and then only from level 17 onwards). From the early part of their career, full casters are regaining 1 of each spell slot no matter if it is a short or long rest. From level 7 onwards, their higher level slots start to outpace their proficiency bonus until level 17 when their proficiency bonus maxes out and they are regaining a 1st to 6th level slot each rest.

 

[Jester David]

You'd have to give a pretty darn big buff to most of the other classes (and the warlock) to balance this. Since even at level 1 a wizard or cleric is getting a 1st level spell every short rest. It's a huge increase to power.

 

[aco175]

I'm not seeing the need for this, the PHB already gives wizards something similar with Arcane Recovery. I'm not sure if you think that this is not powerful enough or balances to the other casters. I would think that the designers thought about this and chose to go this way. Looking at the other casters I find this to be a good power and one of the reasons I choose wizard over sorcerer or warlock.

 

[Eltab]

OP:
If Arcane Recovery isn't getting the job done in your campaign, boost that somehow (working in the proficiency bonus sounds neat - more-experienced characters get more back than the newbies). What you described, though, sounds like an 'infinite Fireball generator'.

 

[pming]

Hiya!

I'd probably just make a rule that allows full-casters (all of the Arcane ones; but not 'part time' ones, like the Eldritch Knight, or Divine ones like Cleric or Druid) to substitute 1 Spell Level regained for 5hp of "HD resting". Casters generally don't have quite as many HP's as others, so that makes it a trade-off. Making it 5hp also means it pretty much relegates it's use to very desperate situations...ones where one particular spell is REALLY needed again, AND the caster needs to likely spend/use 2 HD's worth of 'rest healing' to get a 1st level spell. I'd play it out as the caster taking the time to pour over his notes, hit the books, scribble formula, arcane symbols, and perform rituals of burning incense, chanting, or whatever....while everyone else is resting comfortable on their bedroll's getting a good nights sleep.

That said...it might just be an easier "fix" to just allow casters to write spell scrolls easier with a smaller cost...but have those spell scrolls "tied to the caster" (meaning nobody else can use them). Probably easier in the long run.

^_^

Paul L. Ming