D&D 5E (2014) Human Racial Benefits

[Paraxis]

I guess that depends on how you interpret the stats, then. Is someone with Cha 8 significantly less charming than someone with Cha 10? Or is it negligible?

Using math as the guidelines, I treat someone a -1 as barely noticeable, since it's something that doesn't have an impact on anything, ninety-five percent of the time. It's only one time in twenty that the Cha 8 character will say something dumb and offend the NPC.

If you interpret the stats as much more meaningful than the math would suggest, then I can see the merit in taking a +1 to a bunch of stats that almost never come up.

I don't get why some people want to make more out of an ability score than it is.

A 6 Int doesn't mean anything more than a -2 on a d20 roll, having proficiency in the related skill puts you on par with a person with an 11. The d20 is a huge range, a 6 Int barbarian rolls Int (history) to see what he knows about an ancient dragon graveyard he gets an 18, the wizard with a 20 Int rolls Int (history) and gets a an 11 on the die, after modifiers for both have proficiency they get the same result.

The NPC doesn't treat you any different if you have a 4 Cha as long as you roll well.

Stats are only the modifiers, and if you want to multiclass you need a couple 13's, that is it.

 

[KarinsDad]

I guess that depends on how you interpret the stats, then. Is someone with Cha 8 significantly less charming than someone with Cha 10? Or is it negligible?

It's measurable. There are 5 basic possibilities when one considers PCs:

8 Cha: Negative influence
10 Cha: Average influence
12 Cha: Above average influence, very few PCs are higher than this.
14 Cha: Positive influence
16+ Cha: Various levels of beyond the pale, only a small handful of PCs/NPCs get up into these levels

An Ogre has a Cha of 7. A PC with a Cha of 8 is just a hair above that.

Bugbears have 9. Goblins have 8.

Pretty much, these are scummier PCs/NPCs.

If you want to treat an 8 the same as a 12 or 14 when not making a dice roll, go ahead.

The vast majority of PCs are in the 8 to 12 range (IME) and 12 tends to be fairly convincing, 8 doesn't. The bard is very convincing (as he should be).


Bottom line, if your players game the system and throw in a few dump stats, the system should respond. Not all the time and not excessively harshly, but an 8 sucks compared to a 12 in practically anything (e.g. 8 Str can carry 120 points, 12 Str can carry 180 pounds). For Str, the difference between 8 and 10 is 30 pounds carrying and 60 pounds pushing. The difference between 8 and 12 is the difference between being proficient and being non-proficient at low levels.

 

[KarinsDad]

The NPC doesn't treat you any different if you have a 4 Cha as long as you roll well.

Roll well?

I do not use dice often for roleplaying. It's for when an NPC is on the fence, not for what should happen based on what is said and the Cha of the PC.

A 4 Cha PC in my game would be treated like the village drunk, regardless of dice rolls. A 4 Int PC in my game would be treated like the village idiot, regardless of dice rolls.


One of my pet peeves is a player that comes to my game and says:

"I want to look around for xyz" and rolls a Perception roll without even being asked.

Ditto for players that say "I want to smooth talk the mayor into giving us more reward" and rolls a Persuasion check without even being asked.

The dice (as per page 6 of the PHB) are for "in those cases, the DM decides what happens, often relying on the roll of a die". Not always, often.

The player who explicitly spent the 4 more ability score points for Cha to get a 12 gets the edge over the player who dumped the Cha to an 8 when roleplaying. Player 1 paid for that advantage. Player 2 did not, so he doesn't get it. Pros and Cons.

The first PC might easily talk the merchant into a 10% discount and I might not even bother to roll. The second PC does not. If the first player asks for a 30% discount, then dice are rolled and I set the DC accordingly. If the second player asks for a 30% discount, then dice are rolled and I set the exact same DC. He's already at -2 compared to the other player. The second PC might need to roll (relatively easy, but still not automatic) to get the 10% discount that the first PC got automatically.

But I don't need to roll dice for something as easy to determine as a 10% discount. I consider that something a merchant might do just for good repeat business and especially for a PC with a decent Cha and the player roleplayed well.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

If you want to treat an 8 the same as a 12 or 14 when not making a dice roll, go ahead.

It's not that I treat them the same. I just treat them as very similar. The 12 will do better than the 8, over time. There are a lot of basic interactions that we gloss over for gameplay, where it would come into effect. Most of the time, though, with just minimal interactions - you wouldn't be able to tell them apart.

But if Cha 16+ was some ridiculously charming individual, bordering on the supernatural, then I wouldn't expect the average Cha 10 chump to out-negotiate this person a third of the time. If Strength 20 was Conan and Strength 8 was Rincewind, then I wouldn't expect Rincewind to out-muscle Conan as often as the dice would suggest.

 

[Paraxis]

Roll well?

I do not use dice often for roleplaying. It's for when an NPC is on the fence, not for what should happen based on what is said and the Cha of the PC.

A 4 Cha PC in my game would be treated like the village drunk, regardless of dice rolls. A 4 Int PC in my game would be treated like the village idiot, regardless of dice rolls.


One of my pet peeves is a player that comes to my game and says:

"I want to look around for xyz" and rolls a Perception roll without even being asked.

Ditto for players that say "I want to smooth talk the mayor into giving us more reward" and rolls a Persuasion check without even being asked.

The dice (as per page 6 of the PHB) are for "in those cases, the DM decides what happens, often relying on the roll of a die". Not always, often.

The player who explicitly spent the 4 more ability score points for Cha to get a 12 gets the edge over the player who dumped the Cha to an 8 when roleplaying. Player 1 paid for that advantage. Player 2 did not, so he doesn't get it. Pros and Cons.

The first PC might easily talk the merchant into a 10% discount and I might not even bother to roll. The second PC does not. If the first player asks for a 30% discount, then dice are rolled and I set the DC accordingly. If the second player asks for a 30% discount, then dice are rolled and I set the exact same DC. He's already at -2 compared to the other player. The second PC might need to roll (relatively easy, but still not automatic) to get the 10% discount that the first PC got automatically.

But I don't need to roll dice for something as easy to determine as a 10% discount. I consider that something a merchant might do just for good repeat business and especially for a PC with a decent Cha and the player roleplayed well.

I don't allow players who describe how well they swing a sword to get away without rolling a d20, same goes for talking a merchant into a deal, or sweet talking a prince. No free passes, you roll a d20 and add a modifier.

Your character can give a rousing speech, move the other players to tears, if the situation calls for a roll there is a roll, simple as that. The guy with an 8 charisma says 3 short words and gets lucky with the dice does better than the guy who talks for gives a big speech and a 20 charisma and roll crap, the guy with the 8 is more moving to the crowd or whatever.