Hydra's Combat Reflexes

[Ketjak]

Oh, I know that.

But given that the encounter in question has been resolved (just a few sessions back), I didn't really need the answer any more

But there was actually a very similar thread that came up for 3.5 in the last few weeks...

Are there ever any new questions in this forum?

-Hyp.

There's one! Oh, wait...

Eh, sorry for drudging it up. My PC group is about to encounter a hydra for the first time ever (they're climbing up from first level, and have 28 sessions under their belts) and I wanted to be clear about running the hydra before he kills two characters with two AoO.

Not that I would really mind doing that... ;P

 

[paranoid]

Are there ever any new questions in this forum?

Yeah, just check out this, for example! Exciting new problems everywhere!

cheers,
paranoid.

 

[paranoid]

... what leads me to this brilliant idea: why not create a FAQ?
a couple of questions really seem to qualify for the "frequently" part... sometimes they are asked again the same instant they go off the first page of the rules forum.

so, let's see: we just need a volunteer, the search function would be useful, and perhaps - a year or so of spare time?

oops. I knew there was a catch in it somewhere...
ah, well.

paranoid.

 

[Ketjak]

... what leads me to this brilliant idea: why not create a FAQ?
a couple of questions really seem to qualify for the "frequently" part... sometimes they are asked again the same instant they go off the first page of the rules forum.

so, let's see: we just need a volunteer, the search function would be useful, and perhaps - a year or so of spare time?

oops. I knew there was a catch in it somewhere...
ah, well.

paranoid.

While the rule about temporary hit points happens to be in the official FAQ already, there is no rule about a hydra's use of Combat Reflexes. Grar.

My guess is Skip doesn't read here, which means we have to mail him and hope for an answer and, if he gives one, hope he places it in the FAQ.

I kind of like the hydra getting N AoO per round, where N is the number of heads, rather than a Nd10+STR mod damage barrage.

- Ket

 

[Vivictus]

Take a look at the Ettin for example. It has Superior two weapon fighting which allows both its heads to control an arm so it takes no penalty on "attack" and "damage" rolls. i.e. It doesn't suffer two weapon fighting penalties. Now, if you look in it's stat block, in the Attack section it shows only a Morning Star OR a Javelin attack. Also in a full attack it shows only TWO attacks being made (at +12/+7) showing that each arm can't get a full attack action either. Now, if these heads were so independent, wouldn't you think they'd each be able to take their own standard action (thus each getting an attack) or that each head controlling an arm would get a full attack action? But that's not the case according to their two weapon fighting abilities nor their stat block. I would apply the same rules to hydras. Each CREATURE can get an attack of opportunity per round. If it has Combat Reflexes then it can get more, but no more than one on the same creature. So no, I don't think a Hydra would be attacking with all 6 heads in an AoO.

 

[Ketjak]

Take a look at the Ettin for example. It has Superior two weapon fighting which allows both its heads to control an arm so it takes no penalty on "attack" and "damage" rolls. i.e. It doesn't suffer two weapon fighting penalties. Now, if you look in it's stat block, in the Attack section it shows only a Morning Star OR a Javelin attack. Also in a full attack it shows only TWO attacks being made (at +12/+7) showing that each arm can't get a full attack action either. Now, if these heads were so independent, wouldn't you think they'd each be able to take their own standard action (thus each getting an attack) or that each head controlling an arm would get a full attack action? But that's not the case according to their two weapon fighting abilities nor their stat block. I would apply the same rules to hydras. Each CREATURE can get an attack of opportunity per round. If it has Combat Reflexes then it can get more, but no more than one on the same creature. So no, I don't think a Hydra would be attacking with all 6 heads in an AoO.

While I agree with you, that a hydra cannot attack with all heads in a single AoO, the rules for hydra attacks are very different from those for ettins. Hydras do get their maximum attack value with each head, and each head can attack during either an attack or full attack action.

Charge with a hydra and watch the tears flow.

 

[Artoomis]

...I would apply the same rules to hydras. Each CREATURE can get an attack of opportunity per round. If it has Combat Reflexes then it can get more, but no more than one on the same creature...

While I agree with you, that a hydra cannot attack with all heads in a single AoO...

How does that reconcile with:

Feats: A hydra’s Combat Reflexes feat allows it to use all its heads for attacks of opportunity.

This is clearly NOT the way things normally work. The fact that it can make a single attack (or charge) with ALL its heads seems to make it fairly clear that it can attack with ALL its heads on a single AoO. It simply is that all heads can attack anytime one can attack.

This is much different than an Ettin, or any other multi-headed creature, I think. It's special - an exception to the normal rules.

This still leaves an interesting issue, though. What happens if you use a feat that avoids an AoO (like Ride by Attack, for instance)? Do you avoid the AoO from ALL the heads, or only one?

The player side of me says you avoid the AoO from all the heads. The rat-bastard DM side says that they are effectively different creatures for this purpose, so watch out, here come the attacks!!