I Hate Appraise

[amwest]

Appraise and Craft

I thought more about how appraise should work, and came up with the following... also some thoughts on Craft...

APPRAISE

I think Appraise should have set DCs for different valued items.
For example:

DC 10 <10 GP
DC 15 <100 GP
DC 20 <1000 GP
DC 25 <10,000 GP
DC 30 <100,000 GP

I'd have to look at the average values for treasure found at
different levels to make sure that someone maxing the appraise skill
was able to identify most level appropriate treasure, but I think
this is pretty close to correct. (You can't take 20 on Appraise.)

I think following other skills for failure consequences would be
good. Failure would mean you are unsure of its value. Failure by
more than 5 would lead to concluding that it is worth some set
difference, like 50% or 10% of its actual value.

Since players could take 10 for most items they find, this would
serve to make low-level (uninteresting) treasure easily and
comfortably identified when discovered. But, when the party finds
higher value treasures, a little time spent examining to them could
come into play. This seems like a good balance.

CRAFT

The crafting system is also abysmal, it takes pretty much forever to
craft anything of use. I realize this was done to keep a consistent
game economy with Profession and Perform skills, but I think fun and
efficicency have been sacrificed for an overly heavy dose of realism.

With that in mind, the Magic Item crafting feats seem to work very
well. The solution I have been using in my campaigns is to allow a
player, with a successful craft check, to make 100 GP worth of
production per week. This allows for creation of standard-value
items on a plausible time scale.

 

[FreeTheSlaves]

Your understudy hasn't even read the book? :\

Nope, not in its entirety... :\

He relies upon me for rules & I vet what I don't like.

 

[Crothian]

Nope, not in its entirety... :\

He relies upon me for rules & I vet what I don't like.

You really should have him read all the books first.

 

[Ogrork the Mighty]

The problem with trying to nail-down rules for appraising is that every item has different values to different people in different places. Rules would have to account for this, making the whole process cumbersome and a waste of otherwise valuable gaming time.

I'd rather just pick a market value, tell the appraiser that value, then let them haggle (if they so desire) with the merchant.

 

[The Souljourner]

We rarely use appraise. For most magic items, we assume the characters know the approximate value, like a +1 longsword is 1300-ish. Appraise is really only needed for things like art objects, that are probably more valuable than the sum of their parts. Since we rarely get a lot of art objects (not a lot of call for art in a dungeon), we don't use appraise much.

As for selling, we use diplomacy, but the end result is almost always 50-80% of book value.

-The Souljourner

 

[the Jester]

I always assume that when pcs sell stuff, merchants take 10 on their Appraise checks.

Pcs can do this to, you know. Saves time and it's generally more accurate.

I hate the entire idea of a given item having an 'inherent' gp value, actually- I like supply & demand having effects. There's one area imc that values copper much more highly than gold, in fact....

 

[dpdx]

I try my best not to nitpick other grammar and spelling - that whole "people in glass houses" thing has always stuck with me - but I couldn't pass up this particular gaff.

What you've written might be misconstrued as a peculiar racial epithet. The gauls are/were an ethnic group.

On the other hand, people might say that I have a lot of gall in posting this.

In any spelling correction, the probability of the correction itself containing a misspelled word approaches 1.

The word is "gaffe." The word is Gaulish in origin.

Appraise? Meh - only if you let it bother you should it bother you. The settings I play in, money is weightless, and it sure is easier to carry than the 300 pounds of armor and gear from that orc band we slaughtered. If you leave the gear with a PC that actually has ranks in appraise, instead of, e.g., the cleric - you're much further ahead of the game than we were.

 

[dcollins]

What do other people think about this problem?

Use the "cooperation" rules, let them Take 10, and assume the second-opinion helpers provide +2 bonus each. I do the same thing with Spot & Listen checks.

 

[CM]

In any spelling correction, the probability of the correction itself containing a misspelled word approaches 1.

The word is "gaffe." The word is Gaulish in origin.

(Going further OT...)

On the other hand, perhaps Arbiter of Wyrms meant to say he was a fish who couldn't pass up that particular hook?

Back on Appraise: As a DM, I generally wing it when it comes to appraisal of valuables. If an item is particularly rare of unusual in that part of the world, the DC is 20 or 25. Commonly-found items have a DC of 10 or 15.

I also have no problem with everybody chiming in with their own appraise check. Who's to say that Bob the fighter wasn't looking at a carved ivory statuette in the pawn shop recently as a gift for dear old mom when the party "liberates" one from the local monster?

Of course, if I really cared that much for the mercantile aspect of D&D, I'd roll the dice for the Appraise checks in secret. In that situation, the party will be much more likely to trust Edward the gemcutter's opinion than Bob the fighter's.

 

[Ace]

What do other people think about this problem?

The easy way to deal with Appraisal is to simply allow anyone with a 5 in appraisal to automatically (by taking 10) identify normal goods and with a 10 they can identify rare goods (by taking 10 for a total of 20) -- It is easier to give em the price IMO

I think the only time an appraisal roll is necessary is when the players are hurried like being in the middle of a burglar job or the like

as for haggling -- I say roll Bluff

Hostile result -- won't sell to you or wants 100% more

Unfriendly -- add 25% to PHB cost

Indifferent -- PHB Cost

Friendly -- subtract 10% PHB cost

Helpfull -- subtract 25% PHB cost