I hope its not just me...

[Garthanos]

oops double post

 

[Sadrik]

I have seen an idea where multiple usage of the same strategy was penalized with a simple penalty... the second time in a row -1, third -2, fourth gives combat advantage etc, admittedly I keep finding reasons for characters to have more at-wills so the players even ones such as your spamming ranger will have enough options to capture his imagination even if the elements are pre-planned. The in game world rationale is the character has become predictable and the enemy is exploiting it.

A variation on that theme that I saw was:
Give every class 20 encounter powers that are at a low power level. That way they are doing effectively at-wills but they are all different. So the first step to implementing this would be to make all the at-wills encounter powers and then develop about 15 more for each class. 15 x 17 classes that is a pretty steep volume of addition. But it will give you the type of variability and flair for each class. Too bad they did not take this approach with the RAW.

 

[Nytmare]

Too bad they did not take this approach with the RAW.

I don't know, I definitely prefer three or four reusable, all-purpose abilities instead of a laundry list that more than doubled all of the possible options available to me in combat. Especially since combat usually only lasts like what, five rounds normally?

It's easier to design, easier to balance, and keeps you from having another 20 abilities cluttering up a character sheet.

 

[Garthanos]

I don't know, I definitely prefer three or four reusable, all-purpose abilities instead of a laundry list that more than doubled all of the possible options available to me in combat. Especially since combat usually only lasts like what, five rounds normally?

It's easier to design, easier to balance, and keeps you from having another 20 abilities cluttering up a character sheet.

When I said wanted more at-wills... I was thinking fairly mechanically distinct 5 (Call it letting people double what they can use now with humans sporting 6 and everyone else 4 ) and Each at-will should include at least a couple descriptions which work for that class to show/encourage how versatile they can be visualized ;-).

 

[Alex319]

Another important thing to remember is that called shots/improvisation/nonstandard actions can be just as easily done with at-wills as with basic attacks.

For example, the only difference between a Twin Strike and a basic attack is that (1) you attack twice instead of once and (2) you don't add your ability modifier to damage. Neither of these prevent you from doing a called shot or whatever with a Twin Strike, and in fact it might even generate MORE possibilities for "creative" usage. For example "There's two ropes holding that curtain up, I'm going to use Twin Strike to shoot out both of them so it falls down on top of the BBEG."

 

[Garthanos]

Another important thing to remember is that called shots/improvisation/nonstandard actions can be just as easily done with at-wills as with basic attacks.

And describing how you do whatever they are can be interesting
just because the book has one description doesn't mean the player
and gm cant ummm play around with it.

I pretend to leave myself open while focusing on one
enemy but when the other tries to use that opening
I divert his attack in to his own ally (attack one), then stab him
while hes trying not to hurt his friend (attack two).

 

[Garthanos]

Another important thing to remember is that called shots/improvisation/nonstandard actions can be just as easily done with at-wills as with basic attacks.

For example, the only difference between a Twin Strike and a basic attack is that (1) you attack twice instead of once and (2) you don't add your ability modifier to damage. Neither of these prevent you from doing a called shot or whatever with a Twin Strike, and in fact it might even generate MORE possibilities for "creative" usage. For example "There's two ropes holding that curtain up, I'm going to use Twin Strike to shoot out both of them so it falls down on top of the BBEG."

I really think a page with multiple visualizations for each at-will power would be a hot ticket and quite useful for anyone who's imagination is feeling "squishy" and DM's who could use help describing npc actions.

 

[Sadrik]

I don't know, I definitely prefer three or four reusable, all-purpose abilities

Instead you get two spammable, niched powers.

 

[Nytmare]

Instead you get two spammable, niched powers.

This is not something that I've seen, even once, outside of threads like this one.

 

[Garthanos]

Instead you get two spammable, niched powers.

yup, which is why i suggested double what we currently have... with encouragement for multiple visualizations ;-), could be sufficient.
And just generating that much would still be some work, but not quite ahem a horror story.

<< human brains aren't real great at storing more than 7 or 8 distinct things in mind at any given time (unless there is pattern involved) so if you hit something just shy of that? like the number of stats it is not so bad.>>