I hope the three core rulebooks have a "DM's clause".

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Is this actually in the 3.5 D&D core rulebooks? I never bought them since (to my taste) the game is too complicated. The promise of 4th edition being less complicated is making me think that I might be interested in 4th edition.

It's the first page of the 3E PHB. I think it got dropped in 3.5 (but is repeated in various ways throughout the PHB and DMG: "ask your DM first," etc.).

 

[hong]

Mang, what kind of wimpy DMs need the book to tell them it's okay to do stuff? HAW HAW!

 

[Lanefan]

I agree with the OP. I'd also like to see something up front in the 4e PHB stating that under normal circumstances* the DMG and MMs are off-limits to players.

* - unless a player is also a DM; even then, when functioning as a player the same restrictions apply.

Lanefan

 

[Glyfair]

"The content of this book is only a starting point for Dungeon Masters. They are encouraged to add to, subtract from, and/or alter any of this book's rules or content to suit their campaigns. Therefore, be sure to check with your Dungeon Master before you create your character about any special additions, subtractions, or changes to this book's content in his campaign."

You know how that reads to me? From the first sentence it screams:

"This is the DM's game. This book isn't for you, it is for the DM. He will tell you what you are really playing. Enjoy the ride."

Not a game I'd even have considered playing if that was the first thing in it. Very uninviting.

 

[Majoru Oakheart]

You know how that reads to me? From the first sentence it screams:

"This is the DM's game. This book isn't for you, it is for the DM. He will tell you what you are really playing. Enjoy the ride."

Not a game I'd even have considered playing if that was the first thing in it. Very uninviting.

No kidding. I'm tired of playing with tyrannical DMs. I've played with a couple and the game is no fun at all.

The rules are there to keep things fun and balanced. DMs keep changing them to rules that are only fun for THEM and then get angry at the players who don't immediately accept the changes without any argument.

 

[Li Shenron]

I'd like to see the 4E Players Handbook have on page 1 a short statement similar to the following: "The content of this book is only a starting point for Dungeon Masters. They are encouraged to add to, subtract from, and/or alter any of this book's rules or content to suit their campaigns. Therefore, be sure to check with your Dungeon Master before you create your character about any special additions, subtractions, or changes to this book's content in his campaign."

A similar statement could be included on page 1 of both the DMG and the MM, only addressed to DMs rather than to players.

Why?

Because I do not relish the thought of some players trying to force a DM to allow races, classes, equipment, spells, etc. in his campaign for no other reason than that such things are in the Players Handbook. The DM in such a case could simply refer the player to the very first page of the Players Handbook and say, "Look. Not only is it in the core rulebook, but it's on the very first page. There are no _____ in my campaign. Case closed."

Whether it is written in the DMG or not, if I run a game it's obvious that what is in/out of the setting and what rules we're going to use is up to me.

 

[Li Shenron]

No kidding. I'm tired of playing with tyrannical DMs. I've played with a couple and the game is no fun at all.

If you think about it, "tyrannical DMs" are almost always the same people that become pretentious annoying players when on the other side of the screen.

 

[Hussar]

Good luck. 3.5 is a player's game, and I think 4e will be as well.

Umm, dude, pretty much this exact statement is in the 3e DMG. People seem to think that it's not, but, really, it is.

Never mind that it is repeatedly stated in book after book that X is an option and to check with your DM first.

But, yes, 3e castrated all DM's and anyone who DM's 3rd edition (or 3.5) is just a mindless yes man for his power gaming munchkin players.

 

[Glyfair]

If you think about it, "tyrannical DMs" are almost always the same people that become pretentious annoying players when on the other side of the screen.

Hmmmm...I wouldn't put it quite that strongly. However, that's only because a lot of "tyrannical DMs" don't like giving up the power of being a DM and rarely play.

 

[Imp]

Yeah, look. You give one of the game's players the lion's share of the work, you give that player perks. Meaning, power, unless you have other ideas.