I think my character is broken. :-(

[Gruns]

Soo...

So any word about the stats from the other non-broken-rogue characters?
Really, the rogue's 18 STR in a secondary/tertiary stat is mostly irrelevant. The 20 Dex is the good part. The Halfling rogue in my party has an 18 Dex, 18 Cha using the standard PHB point buy. His to-hit at level 1 was: +4(Dex), +3(Dagger), +1(Rogue Dagger Skills). That's +8, which should be just 1 less than the "broken rogue" from the OP. Naturally, he is Sly Flourishing almost every round for 1d4(Dagger) +4(Dex) +4(Cha) damage. Add in brutal Sneak Attacks and that's another 2d8 damage, and +2 to hit, of course. So all in all:
Normal attack: +8 to hit, 10.5 damage.
Sneak attack: +10 to hit, 19.5 damage.

Compare this to the longsword wielding Dragonborn paladin with his 18 Str, 14 Wis.
Normal attack(vs marked opponent): +7 to hit, 10.5 damage.

As you can see, under normal circumstances the paladin deals the same amount of damage(more damage if the target attacks someone else) as the rogue, but hits 5% less often. And this paladin is built as a tanky, sword and board defender. A paladin with a bastard sword or maul actually outdamages the rogue without combat advantage. Where the rogue really shines, obviously, is in the sneak attacks. And throughout our sessions, he's able to get combat advantage often enough for it to matter. All in all the rogue has a good feel to it. In a straight up fight, he can still dish out some damage. But when he can take advantage of a weakness, he does to great effect. But I'm sidetracking myself here... My point is that in no way does the paladin feel inferior to the rogue, nor is he having excessive trouble hitting things, or feeling useful. (The warlord in the party, well, that's a different matter.) It seems like your DM isn't playing the NPCs very well, or maybe isn't using the right mixture of bad guys. Or any mixture, for that matter.
Oh, and yes, when you have combat advantage, and crit on a daily, then action point and hit with an encounter power (and then action point again??), you will deal a lot of damage. As will most classes. As intended.

Later!
Gruns

 

[Bond James Bond]

My point is that in no way does the paladin feel inferior to the rogue, nor is he having excessive trouble hitting things, or feeling useful.

First of all, I dont think theres a issue about the average rogue being overpowered compared to other classes here.

It is just an issue of the op`s 20dex / 18str rogue.

Having two 18s is exceptional, and (for good reason) impossible to do with the standard point buy system. My feeling about 4e is, that you really should stick to point buy, as the whole effort of balancing things compared to previous editions depends on it.

(Luckily he didnt went for bugbear to push things even further ).

 

[WalterKovacs]

Adding to Gruns:

Rogue's love defenders, and vice versa, especially the artful dodgers.

Simply put - Defender marks the target, Rogue uses the Defender to flank, but while getting in [or out] of position, willingly opens himself up to an Opp Attack. If the baddie takes it, they not only have to deal with the bonus from artful dodger, they also have a -2 penalty from the marking, and they recieve some sort of immediate retribution from the defender. So the rogue is able to give the paladin/fighter a possible outlet for their powers, while the defender provides some protection AND a flanking partner.

Basically, working together, it can help to make both characters shine, especially using one class feature [artful dodger] to allow the other player to use his class feature [diving challenge/combat challenge]. And if the monster doesn't take the OA, there is still the chance they'll attack the Rogue later on and suffer the challenge anyway.

 

[Nail]

1: we don't know all the rules and are trying to figure them out

Great! Welcome to the boards!

Your DM should try the adventure in the back of the DMG, rather than just trying to make stuff up. It's easier to learn the system by playing through a few pre-made senarios. Even us experienced gamers do it.

2: .....This made it so that only i could hit and the game got really boring for everyone else.

See? You are learning. Now the DM should do a bit of learning: Try a pre-made adventure.

Your DM - I suspect - does not know how to make a balanced encounter in 4e.

3: how did the stats not fit into the +4/+8 method in the PHB?

Because half the stats are under 10. This is called Min/Maxing, and will cause problems when others in the group don't do it.

Put another way: Your PC is not balanced with respect to the rest of the party.

4: last night was our very first time trying 4e. Obviously we don't have any idea what were doing. we bought the books yesterday and tried it out last night.

Cool. Game on!

 

[Gort]

It really makes the game suck being too strong, imho.

I wanted to design the character to basically kill bad.

Make your mind up, man.

Edit: Oops, everyone's being nice to him! Er... well, strikers will tend to outshine everyone if you just look at raw damage. I remember the first time someone brought an archery ranger to one of my games, I was blown away as he blew away my monsters with 30-odd damage hits in the heroic tier! I'd gotten used to fights going on for ages with clerics and fighters plinking away at the monsters HP, and this guy shows up with his longbow and suddenly everyone has an arrow in their eye.

Bottom line is, don't worry too much about how much damage strikers are doing, their job is to kill things dead.

 

[Gruns]

First of all, I dont think theres a issue about the average rogue being overpowered compared to other classes here.

It is just an issue of the op`s 20dex / 18str rogue.

Having two 18s is exceptional, and (for good reason) impossible to do with the standard point buy system. My feeling about 4e is, that you really should stick to point buy, as the whole effort of balancing things compared to previous editions depends on it.

(Luckily he didnt went for bugbear to push things even further ).

Actually, while impressively min/maxed, the 18 STR is mostly irrelevant. 4 extra damage on Sneak Attacks isn't exactly game breaking. Like I said in a previous post, the halfling rogue in my campaign (who has two legit 18's with standard 22 point pointbuy) does MORE damage with Sly Flourish on normal attacks, and 1 less damage on Sneak Attacks than the 18Dex/20Str rogue.
Therefore, I still think it's a case of the other party members having horribly innapporpriate primary stats, or the DM is doing something wrong. There's just no possible way the rogue can be hitting on a 5, when others are missing with 15s.

Later!
Gruns

 

[JiffyPopTart]

Your group might have a go at reading the DMG section on encounter design. Properly designed encounters go a long way to exposing individual character strengths and weaknesses.

DS

 

[James McMurray]

Your group might have a go at reading the DMG section on encounter design. Properly designed encounters go a long way to exposing individual character strengths and weaknesses.

I second that.

I ran a 3e game from 1st into epic levels and rarely had trouble challenging the party. But the balance of power has shifted in 4e. While each PC had strengths and weaknesses in 3.x, those differences are much more dramatic in 4th. An encounter that just looks to fill out the XP with cool creatures is likely to be too easy.

In my 4e epic game the first adventure was mostly a walk in the park for the PCs because I was trying to stay as close to possible to the feel of the adventure I was converting, and only looking at XP levels. That's not to say it wasn't challenging at times, but since I've started sticking closer to the encounter guidelines in the DMG its been a lot better.

Of course, I still haven't seen the fighter use up one of his "stand up from 0 hit points" powers. But some day.

 

[MrFilthyIke]

That is probably why the PHB puts 'standard array' and 'point buy' as the default methods nowadays.

In the campaign I run I've used 'standard array' (method 1) and it has worked out very well - it keeps the PCs balanced, gives each individual PC a nice balance while allowing them to excel in one or two areas.

Cheers

We did that as well in 3.5, though I do normally prefer rolling stats.

Our take on 3.5 standard array was to use the 15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8 set
up and the player can add three to any state in any way they want.
Thus, they can have that 18 they want, or use it to negate that 8.

It worked really well, and would probably work in 4e as well.

 

[Cryptos]

I second that.

Thirded. Once your DM gets a handle on encounter design things are going to change big time. I'm going to go out on a limb here from your comments and guess that you're the only one with the Thievery skill? And you're also the only one who has figured out how to do strong, consistent damage in the party? Once your DM starts adding traps to combat encounters with multiple opponents (heaven forbid he adds features, hazards, and terrain)... well, ouch.