D&D 5E I want a return to long duration spells in D&D Next.

[Doug McCrae]

For me, keeping track of the duration of 3e buffs wasn't too bad, though it would have been better if it was an instant/encounter/day system. The big problem was stacking buffs at mid to high level, leading to continual stat/to-hit/damage calculation and re-calculation. Iterative attacks and power attack didn't help, either.

 

[Kinak]

Longer durations could help to reduce the 15 minute workday phenomenon.

They definitely can if they're long enough. I'm a fan of day-long durations, in part for that reason.

Even then, they can just as easily make the day shorter. If your wizard has ten combat spells, those ten rounds might easily last over multiple fights. If your wizard can have four combat spells and six buffs castable before combat, they'll do fine in one combat and basically just get the buffs for free if they can 15 minute.

There's a lot of discussion about casters "novaing" and burning through all their spells in one fight. But with any meaningful buff duration, they can burn through the majority of their spells before the fight even starts.

I think I might have just talked myself into having long duration buffs but those buffs being ritual in nature. Hmmm.

Cheers!
Kinak

 

[triqui]

I don't think that's necessarily so; a rogue can use Sneak all day long; a wizard might get only use of invisibility all day.

But Rogues do not learn new stuff. They have sneak attack, which is "at will", and it goes up with level (depending on the edition).

Quadratic Wizards means that when they level, their abilities (that is, spells), goes up by level. But they also get *new* abilities.

A 3rd level rogue can sneak, open locks, and backstab. Let's assume that is balanced with a 3rd level wizard, who can cast invisibility, knock, and Magic Missile[/i]. The rogue can do all the day long, the wizard is balanced because he can do it only a few times per day, but their effects are stronger (invisibility>sneak, knock auto-success, magic missile does less damage but autohits).

So, under that assumption, the 3rd level rogue IS balanced with the third level wizard.

Both go up 6 levels. Now they are 9th level. The rogue can do more damage with sneak, can open harder locks, and is better at stealth. The wizard also is better at sneak (invisibility last longer, now he has sphere of invisibility and improved invisibility as well), he can not only open the door, but Passwall and Dimension Door, he does more damage with his magic missile, and also has AOE fireballs, and even more damaging spells. In addition, he can Summon Monsters, Teleport Away, Dispel Magic, he can create impenetrable Walls of Force, he can Polymorph his friends, can Haste his allies and Slow his enemies, he can Charm Monsters and Fly.

If we work under the assumption that 3rd level rogue is balanced with the 3rd level wizard, then the 9th level rogue is not balanced with the 9th level wizard. They can't be. When you have two functions, and one of them is linear and the other is quadratic, they intersect only in one point. In our example, 1st level wizard is worse than 1st level rogue (he can't be invisible, he can't open doors, and his magic missile is pitiful). They are on par on level 3 (as per our assumption. Maybe you think they are on par at level 4, or 5, or whatever other level, but that's irrelevant to the point). Beyond that point of balance, the rogue keeps advancing linearly, while the wizard keeps advancing quadratically. So, past the intersection point, the two functions never cross again.

 

[Aenghus]

I don't like the idea of unlimited long duration spells. In 3e days there were many long-duration buffing spells that were so good as to be almost mandatory, and this made the game excessively complex, increased the gap between a buffed and unbuffed party dangerously, and led to the tedium of (greater) dispel magic exchanges every second battle. This also was one of the biggest contributors to the 15 minute day, as buffing spells constituted a considerable proportion of the spell loadout for the day, and likely could be done once or twice a day.

The only way I could accept long duration buffing spells is if there were hard limits on them - specifically a small limit on the number of buffing spells on one person. I don't want buffing spells to modify intermediate stats - avoid unnecessary math, and having to redo character sheets constantly with sliding modifiers.

I really liked that 4e PCs didn't delay for 5 rounds casting buffs before kicking in the door.

I never want to see the days of having 10 or more buffing spells on a PC return ever again. I don't think it was good for the game.

Buffing spells shouldn't feel like they are mandatory. Otherwise there is too much incentive to spam the buffing spells and rest up when they run out.

But I would prefer no long duration buffing spells, as there is too much room for spell abuse in this design space, even with the best of intentions.

 

[Hussar]

AFAIC, buffs should be encounter only. And none of them should stack. If you get a bonus, any numerical bonus, you get only one for that encounter.

There, done. No more fiddly tracking, no more screwing around with excel spreadsheets, none of that. You didn't generally see a lot of buffing in AD&D, for one, it wasn't needed that much, and two, very few of the buffs that did exist actually lasted longer than one encounter.

Sure, there were exceptions - invisibility lasted all day long as I recall, but, by and large, buffing wasn't a major element of the game.

I would really like to go back to that.

 

[vagabundo]

Having a mess of different bluffs/spell durations to keep track off all game is a PITA. The players don't bother and it takes away from the fun if I try and make them. Sure 4e had problems in combat with tracking all of it, but with 3e spell durations it was all the time.

I'm not against longer spell durations, but keep the system streamlined and intuitive.

 

[ForeverSlayer]

Having a mess of different bluffs/spell durations to keep track off all game is a PITA. The players don't bother and it takes away from the fun if I try and make them. Sure 4e had problems in combat with tracking all of it, but with 3e spell durations it was all the time.

I'm not against longer spell durations, but keep the system streamlined and intuitive.

In 3rd edition, buffs almost always came from spells while in 4th edition you had them in everything, even down to where you move. 4th edition holds the title for "all the time" modifiers.

 

[Invisible Stalker]

I can't live in a world without permanent magic mouth spells.

 

[FireLance]

I can't live in a world without permanent magic mouth spells.

You seem to be doing okay so far in this one.

 

[The Shadow]

You seem to be doing okay so far in this one.

They're called iPods here.

Come to think... Television is basically our world's version of the Crystal Hypnosis Ball.