D&D 5E If the DM plays his own PC is it ok for the party to kill him and take his stuff?

[Plaguescarred]

DMPCs are not Player Characters. Nor are they NPCs.

They are the literal embodiment of playing RPGs wrong.

DMPC are just NPC that progress and level up. What is problematic is when DMs don't manage them well. Wether they level up or not, have character sheet, sidekick or monster statblock, how the DM runs them is what matter.

 

[Lanefan]

It can be done well, but tends not to.

How impartial can a DM be toward ones own character?

Quite, if one just lets the dice fall where they may.

It is better to let a player control the DM-PC, similar to letting a player control the PC of an other player who cant make it one night to the session.

In most situations, yes. Sometimes the controlling player by necessity won't have all the relevant info, though, thus the DM should retain right of veto.

 

[Lanefan]

DMPCs are not Player Characters. Nor are they NPCs.

There's no difference between a DMPC and an NPC, in that each is a character in the setting that is (provisionally) under the control of the DM.

They are the literal embodiment of playing RPGs wrong.

So you're flat-out saying that not just me but every DM in our crew has been doing it wrong for the past 40+ years.

Thanks for that...

 

[Jaeger]

DMPC are just NPC that progress and level up. What is problematic is when DMs don't manage them well. Whether they level up or not, have character sheet, sidekick or monster statblock, how the DM runs them is what matter.

Sidekick: Have another player play the sidekick to a PC as a second character.

No reason at all for a GM to play a sidekick for the group.


Henchmen/Hirelings: Let the players control them.

Give them to a player with some bullet point notes how to play them. (Their personality / goals.)

No real reason for the GM to take on the additional work load.

There's no difference between a DMPC and an NPC, in that each is a character in the setting that is (provisionally) under the control of the DM.

I disagree. Big difference.

This thread is full of examples of why the DMPC is a big raging red flag.

So you're flat-out saying that not just me but every DM in our crew has been doing it wrong for the past 40+ years.

Thanks for that...

If they have their own PC (DMPC) in the party that progresses, and levels up as just another party member?

Then yes.

And you're welcome.

 

[LongTimeLurker]

DM PCs are bad form at best. It is recommended that they be killed ASAP with extreme prejudice.

 

[Swarmkeeper]

There's no difference between a DMPC and an NPC, in that each is a character in the setting that is (provisionally) under the control of the DM.

I disagree. Big difference.

This thread is full of examples of why the DMPC is a big raging red flag.

In @Lanefan's defense, they play a modified version of 1e so a DMPC very well could be equivalent to an NPC in their games.

Meanwhile, in 5e, NPCs do not follow the rules of PCs.

So, yeah, it is edition specific. Given that this is a 5e thread, however, it is safe to say that DMPC =/= NPC. @Lanefan, you might avoid confusion by mentioning the edition you are playing when making your claims.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Nevermind. I should have cooled off before posting.
Apologies.

I’m sorry if I pissed you off upthread. I wasn’t trying to be aggro about it, but I can see how what I wrote could be taken badly.

 

[Warpiglet-7]

This is acceptable.



No, it is an object lesson.

Then you tell the GM why you did it.

If the DM doesn't understand what they did wrong, then it is time to vote with your feet.




DMPCs are not Player Characters. Nor are they NPCs.

They are the literal embodiment of playing RPGs wrong.

This seems like hyperbole to me.

we have had shared campaigns off and on for many years.

then again, we’re mature and friends. We bask in each other’s successes but have also let the dice fall where they may. We have killed each others characters and DMPCs have died too.

I can appreciate that other’s experiences can differ along with different players.

 

[Jaeger]

This seems like hyperbole to me.

Holy F#@%! Someone online that recognizes hyperbole!

Knock me over with a feather...

That being said; My group actually did this in back in college in a game when the GM (college friend) had a raging DMPC. It was the only way to get across our point!

We got away with it due to the situational circumstances.

In all seriousness... Talk with your GM like a F#@%ing Adult.

Then vote with your feet if they are intractable, and do not change their ways.

Just because hyperbole was used, that doesn't mean that the overall point was not over target...

DMPCs are raging red flags for a reason.

In @Lanefan's defense, they play a modified version of 1e so a DMPC very well could be equivalent to an NPC in their games.

Then congrats, his system/group is an exception. Exceptions do not disprove the general rule.

Anyone can list off exceptions in any general discussion: "Twilight Cleric? I don't see the problem; we run completely without issue in my game!'

Yeah, buddy: Pat your self on the back. You're that guy, in that group.

But in this current thread, and the many like it in the past bear witness that in general, and for the overwhelming majority of players that encounter them: The DMPC is bad wrong fun.

 

[Warpiglet-7]

Holy F#@%! Someone online that recognizes hyperbole!

Knock me over with a feather...

That being said; My group actually did this in back in college in a game when the GM (college friend) had a raging DMPC. It was the only way to get across our point!

We got away with it due to the situational circumstances.

In all seriousness... Talk with your GM like a F#@%ing Adult.

Then vote with your feet if they are intractable, and do not change their ways.

Just because hyperbole was used, that doesn't mean that the overall point was not over target...

DMPCs are raging red flags for a reason.





Then congrats, his system/group is an exception. Exceptions do not disprove the general rule.

Anyone can list off exceptions in any general discussion: "Twilight Cleric? I don't see the problem; we run completely without issue in my game!'

Yeah, buddy: Pat your self on the back. You're that guy, in that group.

But in this current thread, and the many like it in the past bear witness that in general, and for the overwhelming majority of players that encounter them: The DMPC is bad wrong fun.

Or adults can play without being asshats. We can. Can’t you?

honestly did not know we were so exceptionally good.