If you could have created D&D before Gygax..

[Aethelstan]

By "classic" D&D I mean the game as set forth in the 1st edition Advanced D&D hardcovers.
If this is not generally considered classic, I'm sorry. However, its not hughly relevent to the general question I'm posing.

 

[MoogleEmpMog]

By "classic" D&D I mean the game as set forth in the 1st edition Advanced D&D hardcovers.
If this is not generally considered classic, I'm sorry. However, its not hughly relevent to the general question I'm posing.

I would consider basic D&D, particularly the Rules Cyclopedia, the "classic" form, if only because I think it was a much better game than AD&D.

Allow me to add another vote to XP not being tied to killing monsters and taking their stuff.

 

[rogueattorney]

yeah, Virel, please explain. I hadn't heard about this plan and am curious. What was the fourth book?

My guess - a book of magic, separated out from the main PHB.

The fourth core book was to be a Deities & Demigods (Gary didn't like the name, Legends & Lore). If I recall, it was going to have a more in depth introductory section and also have the Greyhawk gods. There was a pretty long thread on DF on this a few weeks ago [EDIT - It woudl be more accurate to say that someone dug up this old thread at DF a few weeks ago]... here...

http://www.dragonsfoot.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=239

R.A.

 

[mmadsen]

By "classic" D&D I mean the game as set forth in the 1st edition Advanced D&D hardcovers. If this is not generally considered classic, I'm sorry. However, its not hughly relevent to the general question I'm posing.

Well, if we're pretending we can go back in time and become the “Godfather” of RPGs by publishing our own personal version of D&D a year before Gary Gygax, then I think it's quite relevant -- but I agree that we shouldn't waste our time arguing what qualifies as "classic" D&D.

At any rate, if I were introducing the novel concept of a roleplaying game, I'd want the system to be clean and simple, but well spelled out -- and it should be immediately obvious how to play. I'd want it to be more like the old Basic Set than AD&D, but with the cleaner, more unified rules (and the more flexible philosophy) of d20. I wouldn't add any of the modern detail and complexity though.

 

[Slobber Monster]

Here's my short list:

...

-"Fire and Forget" magic: bland and predictable. In mythology, legend and fantasty, magic is wonderous, unpredictable and tinged with danger. Fantasy magic should be like shooting a shotgun: its a blast but you wince a little just before you sqeeze the trigger.

I'm sorry, but this last bit made me snicker. Have you ever fired a shotgun before? It's not a big deal to someone who has done it dozens or hundreds of times. Rather, it is a predictable, reliable thing which produces consistant results - aim ahead of the moving object, squeeze the trigger, and it vaporizes.

In literature, magic is scary and mysterious to the non-initiate. To the practitioner it is usually as reliable and consistant as pulling the trigger on a shotgun. Did Circe worry about the reliability of her magic when turning men into pigs? What about Gandalf lighting the end of his staff? Why shouldn't a player be allowed to do those things in a game if they desire?

Of course there can always be those things that are dangerous because they're a little out of reach, or rely on supernatural entities, or whatever. However I see no reason why all magic must be that way, or even the default state of the game. If the PC's are to be allowed to practice magic, then it needs to codified and concrete to the point that they find it useful - otherwise why bother?

 

[WayneLigon]

mm, I choose the three hardcover books because they propelled D&D from a small niche to a game with wide appeal. If D&D had remained an odd assortment of little softcovers, we wouldn't be playing it today.

We actually have national press coverage to thank for that, in the form of James Egbert. I think I remember Gygax mentioning in one of the tremendous spike in sales that came out of that; something like a 1000% increase. If not for that, I have to wonder what would have happened.

 

[Aethelstan]

Yes Slobber, I've fired a shotgun and a lot of other firearms as well. I was trying to evoke an image of something powerful that could hurt you if not handled properly. I think that describes a shotgun rather well. I agree that not all legendary account of magic portray magic as dangerous. My issue with D&D magic is that its virtually zero risk. More often that not in legendary and fantasy literature, there is a price to pay for practicing magic: Wizards must form pacts with Gods or demons in exchange for power. Rare or forbidden items are needed to cast a spell (human blood, hair of the dog that bit you, etc.). Arcane knowledge may drive the wizard mad. Spells may have unforeseen or even disasterous conseqences (think of poor Mickey Mouse in the "Sorcerer's Apprentice"). D&D magic does not cost anything (besides time and gold), always works in a consistant matter and never harms the caster (Fireball "friendly fire" incidents don't count). In short D&D magic is safe. In all the accounts of magic I've ever
come across, it is seldom, if ever, portrayed as safe.

 

[Droogie]

I would have kept class archtypes and levels. These are some of the most addictive features of the game.

And I would not have used a vancian spell system. In fact, if you want to see what kind of game I would have made, take a look at Blue Rose (and maybe roll back the 'romantic' fantasy a tad).

 

[MonsterMash]

Lets see - what would I have kept/changed

Keep:
Archetypal classes and Levels
Vancian magic
No focus on a particular legend or literary source (ok, arguably the magic system is Vance specific)


Change:
Armour/combat mechanism - this is one area where I do feel the D20 version of D&D has things right compared to earlier editions


Some more is bound to come to me and I'll post it later

 

[talinthas]

the question i have is if a modern person went back and remade D&D in their image, would it even have taken off as it did? Gygax's vision blew up massively because it was the right spark for the wargaming tinder they had sitting around. It carried enough of the gamer legacy of the time with splashes of fiction they were familiar with, and pushed it to a new level. All these modern ideas that sprung from that core may not have taken root in the soil that gygax had to work with.