I'm having a gamer identity crisis. Please help.

[mhensley]

I felt pretty much the same way that you do about 3rd edition and I finally feel that I have found the perfect version of D&D. For me, its C&C. Its as simple and as fast to play as Basic D&D, but without all of its restrictions (only 4 classes, races as classes, demihuman level limits, etc.).

 

[mhensley]

Hackmaster is something you might find a lot of fun.

HM is more complicated than 3E, not less.

 

[Frostmarrow]

You can still use D&D-modules with C&C. Slap them around with Feast of Goblyns and they won't care it says C&C on the cover of the box.

 

[Henry]

You can't go wrong with any of them, truthfully. Most of the old material for 1E and 2E (and Basic D&D) is available through www.rpgnow.com as PDF's, if you have trouble finding it through ebay or used bookstores or what have you, so as a DM you'd be set.

If you want the closest feel to 3E without the elements you mentioned, use 1st edition, and add a few house rules. (Mostly, you want to clear up initiative, surprise, and that weapon vs. AC stuff.) My group for years played 1E, but with the d10 initiative system and negative hit point rules of 2nd edition - the funny part was, we weren't using second edition, those were just house rules that we developed independently, and so did lots of other gamers; that's where they got it from in 2E, by just rule-encoding what a lot of use were already doing.

The other parts of 1E (Notably, I'm talking about using AD&D and including the original Unearthed Arcana) are VERY close to the range of options you'll get with 3E.

 

[francisca]

HM is more complicated than 3E, not less.

To quote "The Dude": "That's like, your opinion, man."

In general, I find it easier to remember if I need to roll high or low in a situation that it is to remember what feats, skills, synergies, conditions, etc... go into the modifier.

d20 has a simple unified mechanic: d20 + mods. But the devil is in the details of the mod. Sometimes determining what mods apply require stopping the game and thumbing through a 300+ page book. d20 (at least D&D 3.x) is *not* any simpler than previous editions of the game (and by extention, HM) simply because it uses a single mechanic for just about everything.

Now, if you want to talk about the time/effort needed to track honor and alignment in Hackmaster, I can turn the wheel while you grind the axe. However, you can drop that stuff from HM and wing it, while still retaining the HM flavor.

Johnie Freedom: I'm in the middle of re-editing my house rules for my Basic/Expert D&D game, which includes options for eliminating the "race as class" stuff, and replacing them with an AD&D like system. Let me know if you want to have a look at them, and I'll post a link when the edits are completed.

 

[Nightwing]

Listen to your heart

Johnnie,

You should go with what you've been saying from the start. You said you dislike the complex rules. I am going to assume this is because you'd rather tell a story without having to worry too much about book-keeping. So just play the game that lets you tell a story in the msot enjoyable fashion. Whatever that game is, that is the right game for you.

And take a look at Joseph Campbell's "The Hero of a Thousand Faces", particularly chapter 1 on Myth and Dream, as he speaks of the long history through humanity of telling adventure stories of mythic heroes (aka role playing). It's important. Good luck and keep gaming.

Outwit and punch on.
- Nightwing

http://www.piscesallmedia.com/golden/

 

[francisca]

And take a look at Joseph Campbell's "The Hero of a Thousand Faces", particularly chapter 1 on Myth and Dream, as he speaks of the long history through humanity of telling adventure stories of mythic heroes (aka role playing). It's important.

Let me second that. Great, great book.

 

[Piratecat]

The real problem with 2e will be finding players. I suspect that it would be easier to find a group if you're playing C&C instead. I know I wouldn't touch the former with a 12 foot pole, but I'd consider the latter.

 

[francisca]

The real problem with 2e will be finding players. I suspect that it would be easier to find a group if you're playing C&C instead. I know I wouldn't touch the former with a 12 foot pole, but I'd consider the latter.

Your Milage May Vary

I've had to turn people away from my Baisc/Expert game. But yeah, most people I know, which includes 3e, 1e, and Basic/Expert players wouldn't play 2e. I would, having never played 2e, just for the experience.

 

[diaglo]

play something you haven't yet.

play the Original.

OD&D(1974) is the only true game. All the other editions are just poor imitations of the real thing.