Shades of Green
Explorer
I am undecided yet about 4e - I'll have to see some serious reviews about it and hear about its features before I could form an opinion.
D&D 4E I'm NOT upset about 4E
- Thread starter Jürgen Hubert
- Start date
I'm very happy and excited that 4th edition is finally coming around the bend.
And I don't think they are trying to dumb down D&D with 4th edition, I just think they are trying to make it more accessible to non obsessive/compulsive, neurotic, elitist gamers.
Don't get me wrong, gamers are often highly intelligent, lovely people, and I definitely have qualities relating to the above. But there are a lot of intelligent (very) people who might pick up this game, who were otherwise put off because of some of the extraneous rules and minutiae.
What do you think?
And I don't think they are trying to dumb down D&D with 4th edition, I just think they are trying to make it more accessible to non obsessive/compulsive, neurotic, elitist gamers.
Don't get me wrong, gamers are often highly intelligent, lovely people, and I definitely have qualities relating to the above. But there are a lot of intelligent (very) people who might pick up this game, who were otherwise put off because of some of the extraneous rules and minutiae.
What do you think?
Geron Raveneye
Explorer
Jürgen Hubert said:
Not upset about D&D 4E either. I mean, why should I? It was pretty obvious it would be coming soon. Every time they throw some completely new mechanics on the market for the current edition, it is "test the waters" time. I think Magic of Incarnum was the first test balloon, and even if it sunk more than it swam, it showed a great interest in the fanbase for some new mechanics, which was tuned in on with following sourcebooks, like the various Tome of... books. Usually, when those pop up, it's obvious that there's a group of designers behind the scenes testing a heap of ideas for the next new edition.
Also getting used to people repeating the "WotC is a company that needs to make money" mantra, which simply means future editions will be already designed with the next edition in mind, and a halflife factored into the production schedules. Look at the 4E concept...online access features heavily into it. Which doesn't mean there will be even more "endless" possibilities, but only an even faster way to sell the same stuff to people, which means even shorter time until the market is saturated and the bottomline will drop, creating the need for another edition change, etcetera ad nauseam. And really...although D&D was always touted as a game of "endless possibilities", the supplements, articles and sourcebooks were always going the same direction, with only minor deviations to take more modern tastes into account. The stuff about elves in Dragon 5 years ago read like the stuff about elves in Dragon 10 years ago, or 15 years ago. The racial identities and niches, the class splatbooks, it usually focuses on the same stuff that the producers know for sure will be bought by the customers. So from a distance, nothing really changes except the way the numbers express that same-ness. 3E actually set a VERY high bar for 4E to come up with some variations on the same topic, while having surpassed 2E by a long shot in making the same seem different. The biggest exceptions are the campaign sourcebooks, which really go for variety to fit to the campaign world.
So if I'm actually upset about anything, it's how blatantly D&D is adopting the Windows scheme of business, but that I've been since 3.5, which I skipped for exactly those reasons. I understand, authors, publishers and graphic artists want to have a living, too, no question. But that doesn't mean that there has to be an artificially created need for a new edition every few years. And from what I heard so far, I'm not sure that you can do something with 4E that you couldn't by now do with 3.X as well, by adding options from some sourcebook or another.
The only thing I'm a bit anxious about is the fact that it'll probably become even harder for me to find a few people to play with outside the relatively static circle of friends I already play with. D&D IS the brand name nearly everybody in the hobby recognizes, and people playing it will always turn to the newest edition first if talk about a game starts. I've yet to see a discussion about "what to play" that starts with Red Box D&D, or AD&D 2E as first option, although those are all games we're just as accustomed to. I've been more successful gathering a group for a slightly modified Shadowrun 1E than collecting players for a game of C&C, or Basic D&D. :\
Carnifex
First Post
I am not upset by 4e - quite the opposite. Firstly, it may clear up some of my issues with the current ruleset and make me excited about the game again. Secondly, I am still a little confused after reading the rpg.net threads about the d20/OGL status of the new edition, but am hoping for something similar to 3e. That'd be the push needed to get me to finish writing a couple of products I have had hanging in limbo for a while now.
Gold Roger
First Post
I knew 4th would eventually come and I'm psyched we'll get it so soon. I own loads of 3.5 books but honestly I used very few. I buy them for the read, mostly. As long as 4th E is at least a little backwards compatible, I won't complain about how heavily I'm invested in 3.5.
Knight Otu
First Post
I'm not upset or angry. The extend of my negative response is that I'm..., well, I'm a tad miffed. I'm a tad miffed that the word at D&DXP was that 4E wasn't being worked on, rather a more sensible we can't confirm or deny anything. I was also a tad miffed that possibly there might be some design space that I thought could be explored wouldn't be, but since 4E will remain a d20 System-based game at heart, I guess it may very well be explored.
No, I'm not upset. I'm intrigued, really. And that more than overrides that "tad miffed."
No, I'm not upset. I'm intrigued, really. And that more than overrides that "tad miffed."
Thornir Alekeg
Albatross!
I personally am not upset about 4e, but to my dismay, the rest of my old group is. They have pretty much all said they have no intention of changing from 3.5 or subscribing to D&D Insider because they just see it as a WotC money grab. Considering the virtual game table might be our best chance to regularly play again from the different states we live in, I was hoping they would be at least intrigued by the idea and open minded about looking at it when it comes.
I'll have to work on them over the next nine months. I pushed the move to 3.0 seven years ago by teasing them with some of the improvements (although the 3.5 migration was more of a bludgeon than a push). Hopefully 4e will have enough changes to things that irritate them that I can do it again, but I think it is going to be hard.
I'll have to work on them over the next nine months. I pushed the move to 3.0 seven years ago by teasing them with some of the improvements (although the 3.5 migration was more of a bludgeon than a push). Hopefully 4e will have enough changes to things that irritate them that I can do it again, but I think it is going to be hard.
