Improved Skirmish Over the Top?

[Seeten]

First, 28d6 vs 80d6 is a huge difference. Second, the rogue has the same 19 bab as that scout, and Mages dont need to eat full attacks, and are far more powerful than rogues or scouts.

 

[Felon]

Scouts are better with Xbows and Xbow sniper anyhow... At low levels!

Well, I do have someone playing a scout with a heavy repeating crossbow, and he's pretty content.

 

[Felon]

First, 28d6 vs 80d6 is a huge difference. Second, the rogue has the same 19 bab as that scout, and Mages dont need to eat full attacks, and are far more powerful than rogues or scouts.

I think the point was that the rogue's iterative attacks take a cumulative penalty. Not sure where the 80 d6 is coming from though. Is this a 2WFer with 8 attacks?

The big, big limitation on the scout is that he can't spread damage around well. AFAIK, Greater Manyshot is only printed in the psionics handbook. If you don't use that, and you don't leaf through the SRD, you probably don't even know about it.

 

[Seeten]

I think the point was that the rogue's iterative attacks take a cumulative penalty. Not sure where the 80 d6 is coming from though. Is this a 2WFer with 8 attacks?

The big, big limitation on the scout is that he can't spread damage around well. AFAIK, Greater Manyshot is only printed in the psionics handbook. If you don't use that, and you don't leaf through the SRD, you probably don't even know about it.

Here is the original post:

Let me consider this and do some math.

Lets say, Rogue 3/Swashbuckler 17, with TWF/Imp TWF/GTWF, we have iterative attacks at

17/17/12/12/7/7/2/2 for 10d6 sneak each, thats 80d6 sneak attack damage.

What was the improved manyshot problem with 28d6 damage again?

Thats with no bonuses, no flanking, no magical items, no buffs. I'm pretty confident you can hit with multiples of those, hitting with 3 is better than the Scout's total. Hitting with 4 or 5 is twice as good. Get lucky, and triple the benefit.

I think if we're talking about how "great" or "broken" skirmish is, at this level, with this feat, we're missing the forest for the trees. Mages are wishing, Clerics are miracling, druids are wildshaping into dragons, and you do 28d6 if you roll perfectly and everything goes right? So what?

 

[Darklone]

Seeten, you're right that it's not like the Hulking Hurler. But you have someone who can avoid full attack actions and still dish out a huge amount of damage without limit (well, arrows).

That rog/swashy needs some way to get full attack actions (plus sneak attack damage) on charges or he'll be screwed.

 

[hong]

TWF/ITWF/GTWF would only get you to 17/17/12/12/7/7/2, which is 70d6.

However, that's in melee. Getting a full sneak attack in melee can be tricky, especially if you're a lightly armoured, low-hp type. Skirmishing with Manyshot is often much easier to pull off, although this depends on the "move 10' away" debate.

 

[pawsplay]

Foe Specialist is a feat that gives +2d6 sneak attack, conditionally.

On Scouts... the Scout in our game is often a damage dealer, but not infrequently falls back on Rapid Shot rather than skirmish. Movement, and proximity, can be a tricky combination.