Inspired by Lords of Madness (Updated with 65% more ideas, and 74% more confusion)!

[Kae'Yoss]

Oh, and I just wanted to add: Sorry, couldn't resist. Of course I haven't read anything about it, and it's a great idea.

That one backfired. I wanted to add this right away, before several other posted, but got carried away with the rest of the post. By the time I sent it away, you already saw it. I have to work on my timing.

 

[Mouseferatu]

That one backfired. I wanted to add this right away, before several other posted, but got carried away with the rest of the post. By the time I sent it away, you already saw it. I have to work on my timing.

Okay, that makes a lot more sense.

 

[Gez]

Of course they can look quite different, and no intermediate species can ge found.

I know the Kopru have already been linked to the mind flayers before. And I still think, as I said above, that an Aboleth -> Morkoth -> Kopru -> Illithid evolution chain seems plausible.

 

[philreed]

End of last week.

Time for a trip to Dragon's Lair.

 

[Goblyns Hoard]

Interesting ideas, but you're missing an important part of illithid "biology": the actual illithid doesn't have legs, or arms. It's a tadpole, and is only vaguely humanoid because the tadpole invaded a humanoid body and ate out it's nervous system. Kinda like the Goa'ld from Stargate SG1 if you've ever seen that show.

So there's no evolutionary reason to have a humanoid form; just the ability to take over and metamorphosise (is that a word?) a humanoid host.

Bugger :\ ... goes to show what little I know about illithid... as I said I've never really used them - mainly cause psionics when I first started playing were so out of whack with everything else I still don't even consider using them in my worlds. OK so back to the evolutionary drawing board... actually back to home and the MM and start learning about this tentacled freaks so I can reason out a new path...

 

[Goblyns Hoard]

Sooooo.....you're talking weresquid here?

Eeeww... nasty

 

[Goblyns Hoard]

An alternate thought <snip> Or, even more amusingly, they are actively TRYING to wipe out the Aboleths because they find the creatures loathsome. Chain of effect the same.

Both work nicely - just need the pressure for them to stop being Aboleth.

Now that I've carefully researched the illithid to learn about their biology (read: been smacked-down by Chris for not knowing about illithid) and know ALL about their tadpoleness I'm going to propose... uhmm... err... what's that

*ducks behind evolving aboleth to avoid embarrassment


Edit:

I do actually really like the "wipe out the aboleth" idea. It really plays to the abscence of predestination that is inherent in the evolutionary process. The illithid are convinced because of their own racial mythology that they evolved from some harmless little creature of some sort that was preyed upon by Monsters - then in going back in time they become the monsters that preyed upon their ancestors while reveling in their 'sacred' task of destroying the creatures that preyed upon their ancestors....

 

[Ibram]

I love the idea of some wierd paradoxical evolution being responsable for Illithids...

In the far future Aboliths rule, Illithids are a slave race created by them. the Illithids overthrow their masters and exterminate them, and go on to rule the universe. The only problem is that the univers is going into heat death, those stars that remain are late in life and soon all that will be left are slowly cooling husks. Faced with extinction the Illithids conceve a bold experiment: time travel. the process is difficult though, and cannot produce a 2 way street.

Using the failing energies of the last few stars the Illithids send some of their own back to the very dawn of time itself, right when the universe becomes habitable... but something goes wrong, the early universe is a lot more hostile then they expected and the Illithids have to adapt. they become the aboliths and proceded down the time stream, creating the Illithids that they know will destroy them so that they can even exist in the first place.

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

"The Old Ones were, the Old Ones are, and the Old Ones shall be."

Sure. But are the aboleth/illithid really Old Ones? Maybe. Depends on the campaign and world. They're not really throwing around "Old One" levels of power are they? Maybe they are some the "children" of such, but because they are also of our world, they are still subject to the kind of temporal causality that we all are.

Btw, I remember very, very little about either race, having not had them in a campaign since middle school, but...

You can get really screwy with your causality here. Maybe the Illithid came "first." They entered our universe at the End. This wasn't the most opportune time to establish dominion, so they have been coming back in time to various points in an attempt to establish an empire with some legs. Maybe one group went so far back in time that there were no humanoids? Or very few. And they were stranded there. Without their usual parasitic schtick they had to develop powerful bodies of their own to survive. The "next" Illithid group to arrive didn't come until millions of years later, so there was plenty of time for the aboleth to forget their ancestry before the development of their racial memory.

Instead of the Illithid hating the aboleths as "animals" the aboleths hate the Illithid as "weaklings."

Honestly, I really just like the notion of the two species despising each other despite being related to each other. So many real world parallels, and it's strongly supported by some basic psychology.

EDIT: #%@! Got beat to it.

 

[Psion]

Well, they didn't hammer down the origins precisely, just provided some defaults.

While the illithids as creatures from the end of time has some appeal, IMC, they are expatriates of the Far Realm. Of course, the way I define the far realm IMC differs from the default a little, too. The far realm IMC is more or less a widely varied primordial soup, from which the Universe As We Know It was built. Some creatures, like mind flayers, saw the new, organized universe as an opportunity. Others, such as the Galchutt liked things the way they were before and want to put them back the way they were.