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Is 4E still D&D to you?
- Thread starter Mishihari Lord
- Start date
delericho
Legend
Yes, but it's a very different D&D from everything that has gone before.
Even in 3e, there was a certain continuity in the feel of the game. Playing a 3e Fighter felt like playing a 2nd Edition Fighter, which felt like playing a BECM Fighter. Playing a 3e Wizard felt like playing a 2nd Edition Mage, which felt like playing a BECM Magic User. And playing these two classes always felt distinctly different from one another.
The 4e Fighter does not feel like the previous editons' Fighters, and the 4e Wizard does not feel like the previous editions' Wizards (or equivalents). And each feels a lot more like the other than they do their predecessors.
And yet, the game as a whole does feel like D&D. I'm not sure I can pin down quite why that is, but there it is.
Even in 3e, there was a certain continuity in the feel of the game. Playing a 3e Fighter felt like playing a 2nd Edition Fighter, which felt like playing a BECM Fighter. Playing a 3e Wizard felt like playing a 2nd Edition Mage, which felt like playing a BECM Magic User. And playing these two classes always felt distinctly different from one another.
The 4e Fighter does not feel like the previous editons' Fighters, and the 4e Wizard does not feel like the previous editions' Wizards (or equivalents). And each feels a lot more like the other than they do their predecessors.
And yet, the game as a whole does feel like D&D. I'm not sure I can pin down quite why that is, but there it is.
Aus_Snow
First Post
I would agree, actually. Sure, I haven't played it or DMed it. Still, it's my impression from reading it, reading about it, and going through various blogs/discussions, etc.delericho said:
In the end, I don't care if it's 'like D&D', though. I've always liked roleplaying games, not specifically or only 'D&D' (even though, yeah, I got into RPGs with B/X.) And this is where 4th edition fails to draw me in, just as AD&D 2e failed, and AD&D 1e paled after a (fair) while. Also, this is where 3rd edition drew me back in to 'D&D': It's a fantastically good RPG - not perfect no, but incredibly good and adaptable to so many things, so easily. Plus, the OGL and the many publishers who
So anyway, to me as well, 4e is 'D&D', yes. But it's the worst one I've seen by an appreciable margin, and I've seen them all (also, played and/or DMed most.) The spirit is dead. That gamer integrity of sorts is gone too, well and truly. It's a soulless husk, a laughable ankle-deep parody of immersion inside whatever it's trying to sell itself as any given month.
This will turn out to be an endless discussion that revolves around the real question: what is D&D? And more importantly: what sets D&D apart from all the other roleplaying games out there?
Without answering that question (I hardly qualify to provide the answer and if I did provide an answer i'd be flamed to a crisp) I say that 4E is not D&D. What does 4E have that connects is to any previous edition (thus making it D&D) and at the same time keeping it D&D (and thus apart from all the other roleplaying games)?
In my opinion 4E is probably a great game (I need to playtest is some more to be convinced of this). But it isn't a new version of the game that we all love and have been playing for 30+ years.
Without answering that question (I hardly qualify to provide the answer and if I did provide an answer i'd be flamed to a crisp) I say that 4E is not D&D. What does 4E have that connects is to any previous edition (thus making it D&D) and at the same time keeping it D&D (and thus apart from all the other roleplaying games)?
In my opinion 4E is probably a great game (I need to playtest is some more to be convinced of this). But it isn't a new version of the game that we all love and have been playing for 30+ years.
Otherwise, the score is a solid 
out of 
If you consider every fantasy RPG a version of D&D, then yes, this is also D&D. But barely a shade in relation to the original game.
It's a bit like finding one of Napoleon's descendants and crowning him Emperor of France. He may be a Bonaparte, but he's spent the last 50 years in Queens.
If you don't consider every fantasy RPG to be worthy of the title of Dungeons & Dragons, then no, the publisher should be more respectful to Mr. Gygax and have the dignity to stop claiming his work as its own.
It's a bit like finding one of Napoleon's descendants and crowning him Emperor of France. He may be a Bonaparte, but he's spent the last 50 years in Queens.
If you don't consider every fantasy RPG to be worthy of the title of Dungeons & Dragons, then no, the publisher should be more respectful to Mr. Gygax and have the dignity to stop claiming his work as its own.
In a word, no.
At this point, I'm going to have to say that 4Ed D&D is D&D in name only as far as I'm concerned.
It may be a decent game- I'm still trying to evaluate it on its own merits- but as D&D it just doesn't work for me.
It may be a decent game- I'm still trying to evaluate it on its own merits- but as D&D it just doesn't work for me.
Sorry, double-posting madness!
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