Enevhar Aldarion
Hero
Honestly, if I were to use a system totally different from the D20-based ones, I would just use Basic Role Playing, or BRP, for it. But then, I like d100-based systems.
First of all, I said nothing even remotely like that. I said;It's wrong to assume that 5e squarely into some kind of golden mean. There are too many elements cranked well beyond 11 or stripped down to the point of intangibility for that to be the case though. In a lot of ways 5e embodies those extremes you mention & goes a step further by designing other elements so changing that extreme is often needlessly difficult. ...
That's not me being right, I said nothing like that.For purposes of discussion, lets say that you are right & that 5e is in the golden middle between wargames like wh40k(or whatever represents the extreme) & narrative based games like fate where movement is so abstract that it's measured in zones which are generally of explicitly vague nonspecific size.
So, you agree that 5e by default is less "Tactical combat" than some games, but more "Tactical combat" than others? That's what I said! Honestly I thought this was self evident but I should never underestimate the ability of the internet to look for an argument.5e is obviously less tactical than the most tactical of wargames so it's definately below 11 on the purity dial there. However it is a trivial matter to bolt grid combat onto fate and get a level of tactical gameplay virtually identical to 5e because moving between zones can effectively provoke an AoO with different terms there.
You use miniatures?Tactical combat in D&D? Use a grid layout for your map and miniatures, so you can measure everything down to the millimeter.
Non-tactical combat in D&D? Use a layout without a grid for your map and miniatures and guess all your ranges and areas and reaches.
You are wrong on point1 & point 2 depends on that being at least close to accurate in order to paint people wanting more as wanting an extreme... that's the problem.First of all, I said nothing even remotely like that. I said;
1. 5e by default has more tactical combat that many other ttrpgs.
2. I often see people making the assumption that if someone likes a thing then they would prefer that thing be taken to the extreme, and I think they are wrong.
That's not me being right, I said nothing like that.
So, you agree that 5e by default is less "Tactical combat" than some games, but more "Tactical combat" than others? That's what I said! Honestly I thought this was self evident but I should never underestimate the ability of the internet to look for an argument.
That you can make Fate more "Tactical combat" completely ignores the context of the post and what I was responding to which was the "default game".
Yes, you can obviously hack a game to make it more or less "Tactical combat", that should be self-evident as well so I am sure someone will argue that it's impossible shortly. Or, more likely make an argument that I am wrong about something I never said.
You use miniatures?
I use miniatures for 5e (or tokens when playing online). Not so much prior to 3.x. Just the occasional sketch on notebook paper - but I was also a student then and didn't have a dedicated gaming setup.You use miniatures?
You use objects to represent characters and monsters?Miniatures is just a catch-all term for anything representing the characters and the monsters. Dice, coins, Hershey's Kisses that the player gets to eat when their PC takes down an enemy.
We always used TotM for 3.xI use miniatures for 5e (or tokens when playing online). Not so much prior to 3.x. Just the occasional sketch on notebook paper - but I was also a student then and didn't have a dedicated gaming setup.