D&D 3E/3.5 Is Briar Web a 2nd level spell in 3.5e?

[Gina]

Still, I think we can try it as you propose. I don't mean to take the spell away from our besieged druid; I do intend on making it a 2nd level spell. How about 20 ft radius and 1d4 hp damage, no save, for any action.

Briar Web is already 2nd level, do you mean 3rd? Or are you speaking of making Entangle 2nd level and Briar Web 3rd?

Just needing clarification.

Rowan

 

[Nail]

Briar Web is already 2nd level, do you mean 3rd? Or are you speaking of making Entangle 2nd level and Briar Web 3rd?

Just needing clarification.

Sorry!

Entangle is still 1st level, only change is 20 radius.

Briar Web (web of goblin death!) is still 2nd level, only changes are 20 radius, only 1d4 damage (instead of 1d4+level). Those are the only changes.

I think that will work. I'm only a tiny bit leary of the no save for damage, but I don't want to be bothered with "save or half" for only 1d4 damage. Let's just do it this way, and see how it goes.

Keep in mind, Rowan, that it's still 1/2 move and damage for everyone in the 20 ft radius. That's like a little slow plus fireball spell. It's still quite potent!!!

.....those poor, poor goblins! Bitter tears flow down their sallow, mauve cheeks!!!

 

[Nail]

Excuse me, the only way to take no damage in a Briar Web is to stand still and get entangled. If you do anything, you take damage and have to make a save to avoid being entangled.

Right.

See, that's what got me. Even if you make the Ref save, you still take damage. Not half-damage -- full damage. Rogues gain no special benefit.

IOW, outside, this is like a 40 ft radius fireball. 1d4 + level damage for each round of actions within the radius. Actions of any kind!

Name one other spell that's got a 40ft radius damage spread. I'll wager you're naming a spell that's 4th level or higher.

As for the cover provided by the Briar Web: That -4 to hit isn't a deal breaker. My archer simply had to use a few more arrows, as the entangled foe was rooted to the spot. It took a round longer to kill the silly thing. Big deal. In fact, I was happy for the total cover provided for me, from the spell casters on the other side of the mess!

 

[just__al]

Right.


As for the cover provided by the Briar Web: That -4 to hit isn't a deal breaker. My archer simply had to use a few more arrows, as the entangled foe was rooted to the spot. It took a round longer to kill the silly thing. Big deal. In fact, I was happy for the total cover provided for me, from the spell casters on the other side of the mess!

But more often than not, it's total cover. No attacking anyone with Total cover.

This spell still is NASTY for a second level spell though

 

[Nail]

Just in case you're curious, I've changed Briar Web like so:

Entangling Thorns (formerly “Briar Web”)
Transmutation
Level: Drd 2, Rgr 2

This spell functions like Entangle, except that the entwining plants grow long, sharp, and obvious thorns. These thorns cause 1d6 damage to any entangled creature that attempts any action, including trying to break free. Note that this damage can disrupt spell casting and other activities requiring concentration checks.

 

[Nifft]

Nice. Consider it stolen, and re-named Thorntangle.

-- N

 

[Nail]

Nice. Consider it stolen, and re-named Thorntangle.

-- N

See, I thought of a better name (yours is quite good!), but I wanted it to come after "Entangle" alphabetically. One of the best things about this 3.5e edition, IMHO, is that "lesser" and "greater" -type spells are all next to the base spell. Makes for much easier cross-referencing.

 

[Nifft]

Enthorned Tangle?
Entanglf?

-- N

PS: To keep it 2nd level, I'd have it do 1d4 damage with NO save.

 

[Nail]

PS: To keep it 2nd level, I'd have it do 1d4 damage with NO save.

And herein lies the dispute between players and DM.......



DM (me): "It's only a second level spell! Why should it do 1d6 damage, with no save!

Players: "Limited utility! Only good out-of-doors! Does no damage if you remain still!"

DM: "Huge area of effect! A 2nd level 'nuke' spell! Not fair to my poor goblins!....err...." (blush)

So now, with the current version, if they are not entangled... they take no damage. So the Ref save does double duty. (shrug)

 

[Gina]

DM: "Huge area of effect! A 2nd level 'nuke' spell! Not fair to my poor goblins!....err...." (blush)

So now, with the current version, if they are not entangled... they take no damage. So the Ref save does double duty. (shrug)

Hey, Nail,

I was also under the impression that the area of effect has been halved in both regular Entangle and the new version of Briar Web/Entangling Thorns.....

I have it written down, and you know how I am about such things!

Rowan