Is D&D 4E too "far out" to expand the market easily?

[Maggan]

Yeah, a lawn ornament.

Here in Sweden, the gnome is indeed a tiny fairy type portly man with beard and a pointy hat, often red. He is basically the odd job guy at the farm, helping with the cows and stuff like that.

When I got into AD&D I had a hard time seeing why people wanted to play one.

/M

 

[The Little Raven]

When I got into AD&D I had a hard time seeing why people wanted to play one.

I know that when I want to play a hero, I don't think of this guy...

 

[Destil]

Well, I find it hilarious.

Stevens is awesome.

Sorry we don't have the same sense of humor.

Damn younger gamers and their internet memes.

For the topic at hand, I think 4E is a lot more marketable to non-gamers. But is has less to do with specifics like races and more to do with the fact that the books have a really really good layout now. Seriously, whoever Wizards got to do the graphic design should be commended (though about the full page and a half spreads don't work as well as they did in the proofs, I'm sure, because of the binding). 4E is a lot more 'readable' than 3E, even if the powers blocks are really really tedious, just because the layout is really good and consistent.

And things like that have a much stronger effect on a new player, IMHO. If you're being brought into the hobby by an existing gamer then it's not as big a deal, but if you pick up and read the books things like this are very important.

 

[Tigerbunny]

For whatever anecdote is worth, I know of two groups of kids (in the 8-14 age range) who've picked up the game recently. Among 8 players total, they have 2 Eladrin, 3 Dragonborn, a Tiefling, a Halfling, and a human. Everybody under 18 I've shown the PHB to has totally grooved on the Dragonborn, and the Tiefling gets love from teenage boys and a certain sort of girl. Eladrin get the "magic elfy" people, and regular elves get "Legolas". As far as I can tell, the core demographic that made D&D briefly mainstream in the 80s LOVES the "far out" stuff.

Again, anecdote only. But if D&D is cool again, I'm happy to see it be a little bit different than it was when *I* was a wonderstruck 12-year-old looking at that blue box with the cheesy red dragon on the cover.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I know that when I want to play a hero, I don't think of this guy...

But... but... that's a Dwarf! (Well, if I translate between English and German... )

Heroes like the ones from legend. I never read about a heroe-like knight-slaying dragon.

There is also a second type of stories, with "unlikely heroes" and "reluctant heroes" or "anti-heroes"...

 

[AllisterH]

I know that when I want to play a hero, I don't think of this guy...

You think that's bad?

If you have the 1e/2e PHB and take a look at the gnome. I swear by the Hoary Hosts of Hoggoth, what the hell was up with the 2E picture of the gnome?

I kid you not, but it looked like a mini Santa.

 

[pawsplay]

Isn't the question though, which of these match the D&D gnome? Only two and thats the gnomes from Deeds of Paks and the WoW gnomes. Of course, given that these two sources are directly lifted from D&D kinda discounts them.

Still, it's easy to see why gnomes have not had great press. When David the gnome and the nome King are the most well known representations among the non-D&D players, it affects even how D&D players ee the gnomes.

Why does coming from D&D discount them? a) we were talking about recognizability in the mainstream culture, and b) the person who made this challenge said D&D sources or not. I really wonder whether there are many popular mediums more popular and recongizable than Wow.

 

[Psion]

Wow. I think that says it very well. There's nothing wrong with wahoo, but it's not to everyone's taste, and it's much harder to scale back than to scale up.

From a practical hands-on-the-rules standpoint it is.

From a managing player expectations standpoint, it's not.

 

[Mallus]

I really wonder whether there are many popular mediums more popular and recongizable than Wow.

There was a South Park episode devoted to WoW...

 

[AllisterH]

Why does coming from D&D discount them? a) we were talking about recognizability in the mainstream culture, and b) the person who made this challenge said D&D sources or not. I really wonder whether there are many popular mediums more popular and recongizable than Wow.

Actually, even there, I don't think D&D fans would be happy with the WoW gnomes. Remember, WoW has bascally embraced the tinker gnome concept.