Is D&D getting too powerful?

[Buttercup]

This is one of the reasons I think 4th edition is well on it's way. 3rd edition is basically the down-syndrome-infected D&D edition. It was potentially good, but they just HAD to go and mess it up. I mean, the experience system ALONE is enough reason to redo it. You need a masters in algebra and a scientific calculator to figure out wether or not you halfling gained a level in barbarian!

We must not be playing the same edition. In my 3e PHB, there is a table that clearly shows you how much experience you need to reach each level, so, even though the forumla couldn't be easier, you don't even have to use it if you're math impaired.

And in my edition of the DMG, there's a table that clearly spells out how to figure challenge ratings. Again, even the math impaired, if they're literate, can figure it out.

I feel certain these things are true, because I'm fairly math impaired myself, and *I* can figure it out with no problem.

It's perfectly ok for you to dislike 3e. But this sounds like a made up reason to me. Or a troll.

 

[Valiantheart]

That just what we need. Lets call people who have different views than our own "trolls"....but only after we question their literacy and intelligence first.

 

[Ukyo the undead]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Is D&D getting too powerful?

analysis
No, your analysis is correct. 3E is undeniably more focused on level-gain and power-ups. [/B][/QUOTE]

And that really create a problem to handle a storyline with the amount of magic resources at hand( scry, teleport, divinations).

 

[jasper]

Lets ac 21 fighter in older editions are ac –1
Which was possible for first level fighter ac 3 armour plus shield Ac 2 plus dex –3 equals Ac –1. Hopefully the party pooled its money to buy good armour fot the tank. Oh the monsters had the best to hit chart
1 edition fighter bab increased every 2 levels so first level needs a 20 to ac 0 or thaco20. A third level fighter needs a 19. A fifth level fighter need a 18.
2 edition the fighters stole the monsters chart so the increase the bab every level. So first +0 bab or 20. Third level +2 or 18. Fifth level +4
3 edition fighter gets +1 per level increase so the fighter has increase by 1.
His Ac does not change in plate armour so the effect is same. Plate and tower shield = tank.
First and second edition parties laugh at dragons after eighth level. What an ancient dragon could have 88 or 120 hit points with Ac of 2? Plus the damage was laughable.

Magic all stacked. I can’t remember when it didn’t. So give Bobo the Tank a +1 ring of protection, +1 shield, +2 armour now the Ac is –2 before the dex. And he gets +1 to all saves. And how many people made sure to roll the percentage of the rings dropping off of halflings.

How many modules had that +x weapon two rooms before you needed it?

If you want some good house rules to bring back the feel of first and second.
Use the xp charts from either edition but use cr xp.
Drop the one item lost if you fail your save. Get blasted by a fireballroll for everything, you may survive with your +5 keen vorpal banana but you be nekkid and you armour will be a puddle on the ground.
Con bonus Only to hit points after tenth level.
Drop Dr. Either you have your +2 dwarven thrower or hope the spell caster can help you out against that goluem.
For every weapon which does better that a d6 increase by one move on the weapons chart. So the great sword becomes a d12 or 2d8
For every weapon which does d4 or below shift down one. D4 becomes d3.
To be raise roll you CON or below. Plus lose a pt of Con every time you die unless you are reincarnated.
For second edition feel chose a prestige class at first level.
Add more languages and the alignment languages. Then kill people who use the direct opposite of yours. So Mr. Magoo. Is that Chaotic EVIL I hear speaking? Say hello to my shining ax!
Elves are surprise on 1-4 on a d20 Rangers 1 –3 on d20 or am I remembering wrong?
Elf dies Suck 6 charges off you rod of resurrection.
Poison save or die, take 1-3 dice of damage, or no saving throw.
At the end of haste roll you con or below or die.
Get barbarians detect magic 3 times a day and make him break them.

 

[Felon]

I disagree. Any and all PC comments should be banned from the forum since by their very nature they are political statements.

How does commenting upon Angcuru's lack of consideration in his posts (in both his tactlessness and his unsupported arguements) in any way amount to a statement about political parties?

It is one thing to be polite and expect politeness. PC people though often use it as a weapon and I really do not want any part of that around here.

If that weapon is used to deal with those who carelessly shoot off their mouths in an effort to get attention, then it's served a damn fine purpose.

 

[Felon]

I equate munchkin to players who create characters who do one thing and one thing only. It is the two weapon fighter who sinks EVERY feat into it. It is the spellcaster who spell focuses and takes other feats to maximize only casting spells. Munchkin to me in simply 1 dimensional characters.

Then your definition is indeed quite unfair. You are deriding players whose style of play is different from yours, but is in no way actually detrimental to the game.

Looking at your examples, they are pretty darn weak. A PC with a fighter strives to excel at fighting, so he's munchkin because he doesn't put skill points into Knowledge Skills. A PC with a wizard yearns to become a mighty spellcaster concentrates on metagmagic feats, so he's munchkin because he never considers taking Skill Focus: Diplomacy. Is this truly what you're trying to say?

Newsflash: D&D is a game where people play specialized roles. That's why classes have class skills. That's why fighters receive bonus combat feats and wizards receive bonus metamagic & item creation feats. Now, if you want to round out your characters by dumping skill points and feats into areas they are not suited for, that's all well and good. Expend some of those personal resources on achieving a modicum of proficiency at Craft (macrame) and then commend yourself for being multi-dimensional. 3e supports that to a degree, whereas previous editions didn't at all.

But to look down on others who are not interested in doing the same with their characters is obtuse in the extreme.

 

[Felon]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Is D&D getting too powerful?

And that really create a problem to handle a storyline with the amount of magic resources at hand( scry, teleport, divinations).

Absolutely. D&D does not do a good job at supporting elaborate plots, complex mysteries, arduous journeys, taut suspense, or moral shades of grey. In addition to the issues you mentioned with divination & transportation resources, healing resources are also problematic as there is very little that can happen to a character that cannot be cured, including death. Schemes involving assassination attempts are rather laughable. Battles do not provide nail-biting suspense, because you know that when it's over you will not be cradling a fallen friend in your arms as his life ebbs out of him.

If you're running a campaign that has more depth than, say, a game of Diablo, good luck. You'll need it. D&D is not a metasystem, and it drives me a little nuts that people try to treat it as such. Its magic-loaded spellpunk nature does not adapt itself well to most works of fantastic fiction. Whenever I catch wind of someone trying to turn the works of Robert E. Howard or George R. R. Martin into a d20 game, I want to curse vehemently because I know they are not going to build a new system from the ground up. but rather try to make a "magic-lite" version of D&D. DM's who think they can imitate those worlds just by being stingy with magic items really haven't given the matter much thought. There's an economy to things in this game, interdependencies that exist between characters, spells, magic items, and monsters. Just jerking out one element and saying "There! All fixed!" doesn't work too well. Works terribly, in fact.

 

[Victim]

A lot of these complaints aren't exactly new. Divinations, scrying (magic mirror and holy font), and teleportation were around in other editions too. You could heal people, and raise dead too.

 

[Bendris Noulg]

True. But with 3E's faster rate of level advancement, Sorcerer's insta-gained spontaneous casting, Wizard's two-freebies per level, and Domain Spells, these become available sooner (time wise if not level-wise) and more readily.

 

[Felon]

Victim, Bendris, both observations are correct. From a certain standpoint (namely, the standpoint of any work of fantasy not inspired by D&D) D&D has always been "too powerful".

It has just gotten more and more video-game-like over the years. Less LotR, more Gauntlet or Diablo.