D&D 5E Is Tasha's Broken?

[Vaalingrade]

The PCs are people. They should not be “build different”, they should be people.

I don't have any interest in playing or watching 'real people', to be honest.

I want to play the people emotionally unstable and empowered enough to go out in the wilderness and rough up the natives and wildlife for money and as a side effect (largely un intended) save the world.

 

[Krachek]

The PCs are people. They should not be “build different”, they should be people.

Common assumption, PCs are heroic adventurers.
just from the Phb : « adventurers can deviate widely from the norm for their race. »

 

[Bill Zebub]

I have to ask: do you really think your physical form should have no bearing at all on any of your ability scores?

Yup.

I mean, I get the argument why it should, and for NPCs it is fine. But from a gameplay perspective it should not.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I wonder how much this argument would have changed (or changed at all), if Tasha's had instituted a three-point system. What if:

Your Origin gives you a +1 to any stat of your choice
Your Background gives you a +1 to a fixed ability score (Adept = +1 Int, Acolyte = +1 Wis, Athlete = +1 Con, etc.)
Your Class gives you a +1 to the key ability score (Bard = +1 Cha, Cleric = +1 Wis, Fighter = +1 Str or +1 Dex, etc.)

Would this have solved this ability score issue, in your opinion, by spreading them out across the character build instead of concentrating them on "race" alone? Or do you think it would it have only exacerbated the problem, creating an incentive for players to cherry-pick all the options just to get an all-important +3 to Whatever?

I think that would have worsened the problem at tables where folks have a hard time ignoring the numbers, potentially, but add a “if you gain the same stat from multiple sources, you can instead choose to take a +1 to another stat associated with that option.” Or even just have each thing give “+1 to X or Y stat”.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Yup.

I mean, I get the argument why it should, and for NPCs it is fine. But from a gameplay perspective it should not.

I'm not saying that you're wrong, this is matter of taste, but personally I strongly disagree with that sentiment. I don't need the game to be a realistic simulation, but I want it to be at least somewhat grounded. The numbers should represent something and that something should make some intuitive sense. And the rest of the game mostly works like this, or at least tries to. Dragons are stronger than rats, elves are smarter than snakes. I don't want the ability scores to be just some meaningless numbers that do not represent anything, and if they're that, then I'd rather just get rid of them altogether. Basically I want the rules to say something about the fictional reality, and if they don't, I have no use for them.

 

[Bill Zebub]

I'm not saying that you're wrong, this is matter of taste, but personally I strongly disagree with that sentiment. I don't need the game to be a realistic simulation, but I want it to be at least somewhat grounded. The numbers should represent something and that something should make some intuitive sense. And the rest of the game mostly works like this, or at least tries to. Dragons are stronger than rats, elves are smarter than snakes. I don't want the ability scores to be just some meaningless numbers that do not represent anything, and if they're that, then I'd rather just get rid of them altogether. Basically I want the rules to say something about the fictional reality, and if they don't, I have no use for them.

One assumption I make, which I'm guessing you don't, is that rules for PC generation only apply to PCs, and the logic in the chargen rules...specifically the attribute rules...aren't meant to be extrapolated to mean anything. If the rules allow for a PC halfling with 20 strength, but nobody in your group actually makes one, then there are no 20 strength halflings in the world. Or, at least, if the DM decides there are no 20 strength halflings in the world...if there aren't even any halflings with above 13 strength...there's no contradiction. Because those rules are metagame rules that exist solely for the creation of PCs, and do not describe wider statistical patterns.

If you and your group further agree that no PC halfling should be as strong as a goliath halfling, then that won't happen either.

If somebody doesn't agree, and shows up with a super strong halfling, and that really bothers you, then one of you is in the wrong gaming group.

 

[Vaalingrade]

Basically I want the rules to say something about the fictional reality, and if they don't, I have no use for them.

Somewhere, a finger curls downward on a monkey's paw.

All RPG rules cease to be.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

One assumption I make, which I'm guessing you don't, is that rules for PC generation only apply to PCs, and the logic in the chargen rules...specifically the attribute rules...aren't meant to be extrapolated to mean anything. If the rules allow for a PC halfling with 20 strength, but nobody in your group actually makes one, then there are no 20 strength halflings in the world. Or, at least, if the DM decides there are no 20 strength halflings in the world...if there aren't even any halflings with above 13 strength...there's no contradiction. Because those rules are metagame rules that exist solely for the creation of PCs, and do not describe wider statistical patterns.

If you and your group further agree that no PC halfling should be as strong as a goliath halfling, then that won't happen either.

If somebody doesn't agree, and shows up with a super strong halfling, and that really bothers you, then one of you is in the wrong gaming group.

Yes, I want the rules for halflings to inform me how the halflings are. If they don't, I don't need such rules. Then I'd rather just have some sort of freeform character generation without races being a rules concept at all.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Somewhere, a finger curls downward on a monkey's paw.

All RPG rules cease to be.

I can work with that if needed.

 

[Vaalingrade]

Yes, I want the rules for halflings to inform me how the halflings are.

They cn do that in text, and then give you the rules for making a special heroic halfling suitable for dungeoning and/or dragoning rather than Captain Elevensies, who will be digested within ten minutes of either activity.