Is this overpowered? Weapon Finesse

[amadeus-darkened]

See, I feel that in some way this could become a little more powerful than intended. Right now there are two classes that hit on Dex, the Archer ranger build (which could get OAs if it uses thrown weapons), and the Rogue class. But future classes based on a Dex to-hit are likely. That means that as more classes are released, there will be a certain amount of power creep using this feat, even though it originally starts off a little underpowered in relation to Intelligent Blademaster. I suggested limiting it to rogue due to having no better idea at the time.

I can't really think of another reason to keep this feat balanced in the long run. I guess one should just be aware that as time goes on and more classes and new light blades are released the feat will slowly build in versatility.

 

[Smeelbo]

I think Weapon Finesse was considered and discarded by the designers of 4E for a very good reason: namely that it greatly reduces the tradeoffs for being an Artful Dodger, as it practically eliminates Strength as a consideration. Besides Athletics, when would an Artful Dodger ever use strength?

As written, an Artful Dodger with 18 Dex/Cha is sitting very pretty indeed. Add Weapon Finesses, and you've eliminated practically his only flaw or weakness. Indeed, he could now afford Str 8, and spend the points pushing his Con up a bit.

As Smeelbo, "we wants it," but as a player, I think it's a bad thing.

Smeelbo
"What if Bilbo had kept the ring?"

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

I don't know what that reason is, but ... well, I've spent a lot less time immersed in 4E than Mearls, et. al. have. I just sort of assume they knew what they were doing on this one.

"When you assume...you make an ass of you and I." Honestly, assuming that the designers know better than we do is all too often a faulty assumption, IME.

I think Weapon Finesse was considered and discarded by the designers of 4E for a very good reason: namely that it greatly reduces the tradeoffs for being an Artful Dodger, as it practically eliminates Strength as a consideration. Besides Athletics, when would an Artful Dodger ever use strength?

Personally I think the designers left out Weapon Finesse not because of anything to do with artful dodgers, but just because they thought that only defenders should be good at OAs. Which may or may not be a good reason, depending on your PoV.

WF isn't going to significantly change anyone's stat priorities; Str is already a tertiary stat at most for an artful dodger. With WF, an artful dodgers' average Str may drop a couple points but who cares? Each character can only effectively afford two primary stats anyway; even if a PC starts out with three or four similar stats at 1st level, he can only boost two of them consistently as he gains levels. So at higher levels, only the two primary stats will remain combat-relevent.

TS

 

[Mirtek]

IMO they left it out of the PHB and Martial Power because the rogue is already a striker dealing a lots of damage and his weakness on melee basic attacks is intended and calculated into his supposed damage output (e.g. not benefiting as much from warlords granting melee basic attacks as other classes).

 

[mlangsdorf]

Brutal Scoundrel Rogues have high enough strengths that they can successfully make melee basic attacks. All this feet does is give Artful Dodgers an equivalent ability. It doesn't seem particularly imbalanced to me, especially with the reduced damage that someone suggested upthread.

 

[Stalker0]

Besides Athletics, when would an Artful Dodger ever use strength?

The big thing your giving up is the brutal scoundrel strength bonus to damage on SA. That's often 3 damage, and higher at higher levels. To me that is THE reason to play the brutal scoundrel, I could care less if my artful brothers can make OAs as good as I can.

 

[Garthanos]

The 'Intelligent Blademaster' feat {FR-PG p134} does the same thing for Int. and melee weapons but only a Swordmage can take it.

So opening it up to everybody and limiting it to Dex 15 and Light Blades should be fine.

I've already added a similar feat to my game.

Weapon Finesse
Prerequisite: Rogue
Benefit: You can use your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier when making a melee basic attack with a light blade.

Love your version (snag) ...did any one notice having a Dex req on an ability which only really works if you have nice dex is redundant? call it a stupidity tax on the user if they take it with low dex.