It feels to me like Hasbro has lit a fire under Wizards of the Coast, and given them

[Umbran]

If it's not enough for Hasbro, I'm sure it would be enough for some other company out there.

Well, there's a curious bit here. From previous discussions, it seems to me that the "Dungeons and Dragons" name appears to have value far beyond what the game brings in. The potential value (in terms of things that could be done in theory - like movies and merchandising) factors into how much you can sell "D&D" for - elevating the price considerably.

Someone who is only thinking in terms of the revenue stream from game sales probably can't afford the brand.

That, and it seems that Hasbro is notorious for only rarely letting go of a brand name once they own it. They tend to sit on them and allow them to lie fallow, rather than sell them off for someone else to work on.

 

[Jack99]

So, ... Magic doesn't sell anymore?

Compared to what multi-national conglomerates consider sales?

No, not at all.

According to Livingdice.com WotC just said today that MTG sales went up 70% in 2009 with a 20% increase in active players, compared to the year before. Sounds to me like it's doing okay. WotC had a record performance in 2009, according to the same website, driven by those MTG sales.

 

[Quartz]

How would a 'revised and expanded' 4e set sell? One with all the errata, and slightly tweaked in the light of experience. Call it 4.1e.

 

[Festivus]

How would a 'revised and expanded' 4e set sell? One with all the errata, and slightly tweaked in the light of experience. Call it 4.1e.

Perhaps that is what the Rules Compendium is going to be about.

I think calling it 4.1e will leave a bad taste in everyone's mouth and won't sell hardly anything to anyone, do much brand damage, and spawn a bunch of "I told you so" flamewar threads. It was very clearly stated a while ago that there will be no "4.5", I doubt they want to make that same error again.

 

[Dice4Hire]

Perhaps that is what the Rules Compendium is going to be about.

I think calling it 4.1e will leave a bad taste in everyone's mouth and won't sell hardly anything to anyone, do much brand damage, and spawn a bunch of "I told you so" flamewar threads. It was very clearly stated a while ago that there will be no "4.5", I doubt they want to make that same error again.

Yes, I rather hope the rules compendium will be like that, with the original classes slightly tweaked to be in lin with PHBII classes, which I find a bit more flavorful and daring in their mechanics.

Of course, with many of the original classes getting new builds in the essentials, it might work out fine anyway.

 

[Windjammer]

Perhaps that is what the Rules Compendium is going to be about.

I think calling it 4.1e will leave a bad taste in everyone's mouth and won't sell hardly anything to anyone, do much brand damage, and spawn a bunch of "I told you so" flamewar threads. It was very clearly stated a while ago that there will be no "4.5", I doubt they want to make that same error again.

Iterated two days ago at WotC' presentation at Gama:

All of the new D&D Essentials will have new material. Not a reprint of existing product.

The old hardback books are still supported.

No rules changes. This is still 4.0.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Given it would probably shut down the ddi, it would actually impair my enjoyment somewhat.

Would it?

First of all, I'm under the impression that the DDI and WotC are kind of one in the same. If WotC went to a different company or something, the DDI would go with them.

Even if HAS just shuts down game production and holds onto the brand, without doing anything with it, the software you downloaded is yours to keep. Even if you stop your subscription, everything you've loaded is still yours, you just stop getting updates.

So the Character Builder and the Monster Builder are all intact.

The Compendium might go out the window, and we wouldn't be getting Dungeon or Dragon magazines, but we also wouldn't be getting books.

That said, even if 4e were to stop production tomorrow, I think I'd easily have enough for a decade's worth of play right here, right now, without any more updates.

 

[MerricB]

Finally, we are in a recession in the boardgame market (see the recent discussions on FFG pulling the plug on BattleLore since the economy can no longer sustain production costs it could a couple of years ago)

I'm sorry, but huh?

From a recent interview with Christian Peterson of FFG:

Q: Speaking of BattleLore, the main BattleLore game has been out of print for a while. Will this come back into print?

CP: There have been, and continue to be, some very serious issues in reconciling the production methods and expectations in the way Days of Wonder produced the BattleLore main game with those of FFG. We understand the lack of availability is an issue and we’re working on a solution. This issue has also affected the German version of BattleLore, while there are still good supplies of the French edition.

There’s a particular trap in manufacturing games, and it’s one that applies here. The initial printing of a game is typically printed in large volumes, which means that certain efficiencies of this volume are not able to be replicated in a smaller (i.e. reprint level) production. This is a trap that FFG works hard to avoid in its own manufacturing, but the original BattleLore printing was of course not in our production control. Not only was BattleLore caught in this trap, but the game was priced aggressively to begin with, even assuming the best of production efficiencies. On top of that, the factory that DOW used for this production essentially admitted to pricing their manufacturing of the original BattleLore “to get the business in the door” -- which means that the costing levels on the first run was eminently underpriced.

This, set against the overall backdrop of an already steeply escalating cost in game manufacturing, has made the core game a serious issue. Reprinting the core game “as is,” would essentially result in a near $150 retail price point, which is obviously unacceptable.

And:
Q: Will the classic BattleLore game continue to be supported?
CP: Yes. We are working on new releases as we speak, one of which will be announced on the FFG site in the near future.

That's a big difference from FFG pulling the plug on BattleLore.

Days of Wonder not only made the price of the core set of BattleLore quite low, the manufacturer made it for far less than it should have been. It's not that the economy can't sustain it at the price it was produced at... it never could sustain it!

The next expansion set, btw, is Horrific Horde, a goblin set. 42 figures - some reprints, some new, including an Ogre mini. FFG announcment.

Cheers!

 

[humble minion]

I don't think Hasbro is likely to sell off WotC in the near future. Big corporations tend to continually accumulate smaller companies, rather than flick them off to somebody else.

If Hasbro decided Wotc (or just the D&D bit of it, which is really the only bit of it we're interested in) wasn't performing, the most likely thing for them to do would be simply stop R&D, stop producing new products, lay off all the staff except one IP/contract lawyer, put D&D into indefinite hibernation, and then for the next X years making a pretty decent amount of money selling video game companies rights to use D&D IP. Reasonable income for basically zero expenditure, the sort of thing corporate bottom line people love.

Which would be a disaster for us (disclosure - I've hardly bought a WotC product since the 4e core books, but even I know how devastating it would be for the hobby to have D&D cease to happen as a going concern) but Hasbro would hardly notice.

 

[Starfox]

Disregarding the probability chance, risk, whatever; I was wondering what people think would be the EFFECT of having WotC sold off. I only see one person comment on that, saying a new owner would be even more focused on quarter sales, forcing a new edition.

I was thinking more on issues like:

• Would WotC's "fall" be bad for the hobbys
• Would some other game company (Pazio, green Ronin) take on the leader mantle?
• Is WotC as it is now working to promote the hobby and having a positive impact?

Personally, I think the answers to this is "yes", "yes", and "yes", but I do find it an interesting topic and would love to see others' opinion.