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It feels to me like Hasbro has lit a fire under Wizards of the Coast, and given them

I'm always a little surprised at the automatic assumption that Hasbro would be worse at managing a multi million dollar intellectual property franchise than would a bunch of gamers turned professional. I feel like there's this underlying assumption of "those corporate suits just don't get us, man! Its gotta be by gamers, for gamers!" that just isn't justifiable. Its an especially surprising assumption given that we, as a group, have constant experience with companies that suck precisely because they haven't got faceless suits directing them- the "by gamers, for gamers" mentality is probably the number one reason that local gaming stores go under.
Many without experience in the business world don't realize that business management is a skill unto itself. It takes more than knowledge of your product to run a business, and this is more and more true the larger your company grows. A business the size of WotC requires professional managers to survive long-term.
 

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Maggan

Writer for CY_BORG, Forbidden Lands and Dragonbane
I'm always a little surprised at the automatic assumption that Hasbro would be worse at managing a multi million dollar intellectual property franchise than would a bunch of gamers turned professional.

The thing is, when people contemplate things like this, they assume the perfect gamer turned professional, the one that can manage D&D and turn everything to gold. And give everyone ponies.

It's human nature. Ask 100 gamers of they think it would be better if gamers ran D&D. Maybe 90% would say yes.

Ask 100 gamers what gamer should be running D&D. You'd get 101 different answers, and none would agree with any other gamer's choice.

/M
 

BenBrown

First Post
It's human nature. Ask 100 gamers of they think it would be better if gamers ran D&D. Maybe 90% would say yes.

Hardly surprising, given D&D's history. The first time D&D came under control of someone who was not a gamer, developers had to do their playtesting in off-hours since they were forbidden from gaming at work.

Now, a reasonable person realizes that not all non-gamers have that much contempt for gaming. Ideally you want someone who's a good business manager, but at least enough of a gamer to speak the language. Hasbro may be a big huge company, but it is a company whose business is based on games. Their execs may not know the specifics, but they do understand that it's all about games.
 

delericho

Legend
Many without experience in the business world don't realize that business management is a skill unto itself. It takes more than knowledge of your product to run a business, and this is more and more true the larger your company grows. A business the size of WotC requires professional managers to survive long-term.

I think you need both. If you have the great business brain, but no passion for the game, you'll get a very corporate product with no soul. If you have great passion for the game, but no business sense, then you'll put out fantastic products that no-one buys.

That said, I don't think you need both in one person. The ideal situation is probably a "Business Manager" (or whatever) and a "Creative Director" who work closely together, to produce great products that also sell really well.
 

AllisterH

First Post
That's ironic. So Hasbro may be more hands on with WotC but only if it's a 'big deal' in their portfolio.

Yeah...the writers originally wanted to call Sentinel Prime, RODIMUS Prime but Hasbro didn't want the name associated with a douchbag character so they insisted the name NOT be used.

Whereas Hasbro didn't even blink an eye with regard to the death of Dinobot in Code of a Hero mainly because at that point in time, the Transformers franchise was still in its fallow period.
 

That said, I don't think you need both in one person. The ideal situation is probably a "Business Manager" (or whatever) and a "Creative Director" who work closely together, to produce great products that also sell really well.
That's generally what happens in growing companies. Up to a certain size, the "creative" guy who started the business can run the whole thing. Then the company hits a critical mass that professional management is required. The creative guy doesn't leave the company, he just passes off some of his previous responsibilities to the management guy and focuses on what he's good at.
 

Mark

CreativeMountainGames.com
It feels to me like Hasbro has lit a fire under Wizards of the Coast, and given them

The tone of a company, and the quality of their output, changes when the business end of things becomes more important than the creative end. I find it interesting how many people who used to work for WotC are still creative and still in the business but no longer at WotC. When the holiday layoff reports from WotC list people who are far from done being creative in the gaming industry and when companies like Paizo are doing such phenomenally creative (and popular and award winning) work with so many former WotC employees at the helm, it seems obvious to me that priorties have been adjusted at WotC regarding business and creative goals. How much of this is direct Hasbro involvement and how much is because of Hasbro influence and pressure to meet Hasbro bottom lines seems of little matter since the end result would likely be the same. This is not a recent change. It just becomes more obvious the longer WotC is part of Hasbro.
 

Smeelbo

First Post
Let me explain my reasoning

Actually, the quote at the top of the thread is mine, from a thread in another forum. And I am not bothered at all.

Currently, I am a buyer and manager at a small but fairly successful game store in the Sacramento area. I have been working in the game industry, retail, wholesale, development, publication, distribution, marketing, support, and so on for almost 30 years now. Here is what I am seeing now:

First, from a game store's point of view, there will be no significant new 4E D&D product for the 4th Quarter, that is the all important Christmas Retail Season, which for most game stores accounts for nearly half of annual sales volume. That is, I do not expect that game stores will do well with D&D Essentials, because game stores tend to sell primarily to the existing base of gaming customers, and are not well positioned to recruit large numbers of new customers. D&D Essentials will have almost no appeal to existing 4E customers.

Second, Wizards is being nakedly aggressive in promoting 4E. For example, the last two promotional adventures, PHB3 Game Day and D&D Encounters, unlike previous efforts, have an actual staff of over two dozen credited, including a designer, an editor, and a managing editor. They are by far the best effort to date, having taken me only an hour or two to fix the errors, omissions, inconsistancies, and lameties, compared to 10-20 hours for previous adventures. They almost don't suck.

Further, Wizards is using both carrots and sticks to promote these events. The package for D&D Encounters includes numerous goodies, including a digtal camera, and a Pizza Hut Gift Card for $25. The stick is that if our store does not host these events, we will have to wait ten days to sell new D&D material, ten days that Barnes & Noble will have those goods for sale. No hobby store can really afford to refuse, otherwise their competitors will get a ten day head start. Of course, Barnes and Noble does not have to host any D&D Events.

The D&D Encounters promotion itself directly pushes specific products by penalizing players in-game who do not use those products. For each player that attends, the event coordinator is supposed to record their Reknown, nominally a measure of how successful and therefore famous their character is. At specific Reknown thresholds, the player gains an additional encounter power for their character. However, the largest rewards are for using specific products. Someone playing a PHB Human Ranger using a photocopied character sheet will seriously have one less encounter power at first level than a Psion Shardmind made using Character Builder. Use of specific products are rewarded more heavily that completing all the quests offered, more than roleplaying "greatness."

Third, sales of 4E books suck. Whereas I used to bring in a dozen or more of each new 4E book for opening week, I am down to half a dozen or less, depending. Sales of Martial Powers 2 were pathetic compared to Martial Powers 1. Looking at my sales numbers, non-D&D RPG sales will soon surpass D&D sales. And by soon, I mean in the next month or two.



So, to sum up, from the perspective of the game shop:
  • 4E sales suck, and are dropping every month.
  • Wizards witholds product from stores that do not host their events
  • Players at the events are disadvantaged without specific products
  • There is no new product for existing customers for Christmas
Sounds to me like Wizards is having a do-or-die moment. Who would be lighting a fire under Wizards except Hasbro?

Smeelbo
Abuser of BBCodes
 

Garthanos

Arcadian Knight
I dont buy/havent purchased any of the 4e books I have purchased at Brick and Mortar stores.... and have been purchasing DDi on top of that ... so if other 4e fans are buying 4e that way... then its the game store that may be having problems.... and Anecdotal evidence is very nearly worthless.
 

Festivus

First Post
What's the going rate for DDI subscriptions? I don't know since I bought as much as I could at the cheaper rate. But the Wizards D&D Insder group has 30,000+ members, and if it's $5 a month that's a lot of moola if that actually reflects the number of subscribers. I kinda wonder if the book sales aren't already moving to a secondary income for them. Perhaps the 4E book sales drop is being reflective of not really even needing the books if they are all crunch because the content is almost entirely in DDI.
 

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