It's Dark Sun

[Mircoles]

Enjoy. My setting's becoming a board game.

I kid, I kid. I strongly expected that it would be Dark Sun for next year, and while it's not my style of setting--I prefer my settings more elegant and civilized (apologies to Obi-Wan Kenobi )--I'm glad for the fans who'll get it back.

And I'm looking forward to the Castle Ravenloft board game too.

There's elegance and civilization in Dark Sun. It just doesn't have much infuence beyond the cities walls.


On topic:

Defiling as an option to boost ones arcane abilites might be interesting.

Want a burst 3 fireburst or one that does 2d6 damage? Defile to get it. Defiling could be used to extend its range also.

Being able to easily amplify ones abilities would be very tempting and rather addictive after you start giving in to the temptation.

No feat required, the temptation is there for all arcane characters to deal with.

Now, what kind of consequences would it have though, other than just killing the local flora?

 

[Scribble]

Now, what kind of consequences would it have though, other than just killing the local flora?

I've been either wanting to mess around with creating (while hoping someone at wotc beats me too it) powers that are sort of "jerk" powers... You can amp you own abilities by sacrificing someone else's powers. Th bard has a little of it (whith its ability to move people's marks around) but I think a full fledged class (or group of classes) would be interesting.

I used a lot of parentheses in that paragraph.

 

[Obryn]

I can tell you that most long time Dark Sun fans I am aware of used the given dehydration and heat rules for Dark Sun briefly, then gave up on those rules. Keeping track of thirst and heat in 2e Dark Sun was the suck.

Yep, I concur. While I wouldn't mind optional rules for dehydration, it represents a level of long-term obsessive-compulsive tracking I stopped messing with 20 years ago.

-O

 

[fba827]

I've been either wanting to mess around with creating (while hoping someone at wotc beats me too it) powers that are sort of "jerk" powers... You can amp you own abilities by sacrificing someone else's powers. Th bard has a little of it (whith its ability to move people's marks around) but I think a full fledged class (or group of classes) would be interesting.

Doesn't the dark pact warlock (FRPG) kind of do this somewhat? I just vaguely recall seeing some of it's daily powers would "injure an ally to do more damage" and "slow ally to immobile enemy" --- something like that (or am i just remembering wrong? I haven't looked at the class in a while)

I can tell you that most long time Dark Sun fans I am aware of used the given dehydration and heat rules for Dark Sun briefly, then gave up on those rules. Keeping track of thirst and heat in 2e Dark Sun was the suck.

Yeah, I'm hoping that the dehydration and heat rules do not bog down the game with tedious tracking -- there can be interesting tracking and then there is the extreme which becomes tedious and more trouble than it's worth...

 

[Nork]

I think tracking thirst and hunger in 4e would actually be very easy and mesh perfectly with the system.

Players: we want to take an extended rest.
GM: How much water do you have, and what was the last thing you ate?

 

[I'm A Banana]

Yep, I concur. While I wouldn't mind optional rules for dehydration, it represents a level of long-term obsessive-compulsive tracking I stopped messing with 20 years ago.

On the one side, I think 4e can certainly make better rules for wilderness survival than the obsessive tracking of rations and water that we've mostly seen since 1e. On the other side, 4e does not have these rules by default -- or at least doesn't have rules any better than the obsessive tracking of previous editions.

But I do believe them when they say that the environment will pose a threat. How they do this -- via tracking thirst or hunger or heat, or some other method -- is less important to me, I think, than the overall effect. If they make water important and make the environment a threat, I'll be happy, and it sounds like this was one of the big things they've been thinking about.

 

[Henry]

They just got me interested enough to buy into the next setting.

 

[Dausuul]

Here's one thought on how defiling could work, loosely based on the old Humanity system from Vampire.

As an arcane caster, you have a Corruption stat, which starts at 0. If you ever hit 20, you lose all human conscience and empathy and become an NPC defiler, totally evil and driven by a hunger to consume life.

At any time, when using an arcane power or performing an Arcana-based ritual, you can choose to defile. This grants a +5 bonus to your attack rolls and skill checks for that power or ritual. However, you must also make a Corruption check (roll 1d20 plus your Corruption) at DC 21. If you fail this check, your Corruption increases by 2.

As you become more corrupt, it becomes more and more difficult to use preserving magic without hurting yourself. Whenever you cast an arcane spell or perform an Arcana ritual and choose not to defile, if the natural roll of the d20 is equal to or less than a certain threshold, you take damage equal to your bloodied value. This threshold is equal to one-fourth of your Corruption, rounded down; so zero from 1 to 3, one from 4 to 7, two from 8 to 11, three from 12 to 15, and four from 16 to 19.

Each time you gain a level, your Corruption declines by 1.

Obviously, the numbers would have to be tweaked for balance, but you can see the general idea. The further you go down the defiling path, the more tempting it becomes (the higher your Corruption is, the less likely any one act of defiling is to increase it), and the more it hurts to preserve.

 

[Ainamacar]

Here's one thought on how defiling could work, loosely based on the old Humanity system from Vampire.

As an arcane caster, you have a Corruption stat, which starts at 0. If you ever hit 20, you lose all human conscience and empathy and become an NPC defiler, totally evil and driven by a hunger to consume life.

At any time, when using an arcane power or performing an Arcana-based ritual, you can choose to defile. This grants a +5 bonus to your attack rolls and skill checks for that power or ritual. However, you must also make a Corruption check (roll 1d20 plus your Corruption) at DC 21. If you fail this check, your Corruption increases by 2.

As you become more corrupt, it becomes more and more difficult to use preserving magic without hurting yourself. Whenever you cast an arcane spell or perform an Arcana ritual and choose not to defile, if the natural roll of the d20 is below a certain threshold, you take damage equal to your bloodied value. This threshold is equal to one-fourth of your Corruption, rounded down; so zero from 1 to 3, one from 4 to 7, two from 8 to 11, three from 12 to 15, and four from 16 to 19.

Each time you gain a level, your Corruption declines by 1.

Obviously, the numbers would have to be tweaked for balance, but you can see the general idea. The further you go down the defiling path, the more tempting it becomes (the higher your Corruption is, the less likely any one act of defiling is to increase it), and the more it hurts to preserve.

I had some similar thoughts, but basing it on a disease-like condition track with Wisdom checks (or something similar).

Preserver: Preserves by default, but may defile if desired.
Tempted: Make a wisdom check the first time you use an arcane power during an encounter. If successful, you can preserve this encounter. If you fail, you defile this encounter unless you immediately lose a healing surge.
Struggling: Make a wisdom check the first time you use an arcane power during an encounter. If successful you may spend a healing surge to preserve this encounter. Otherwise, you defile.
Addicted: Always defiles except by a powerful act of will. Make a wisdom check if you wish to preserve with a single arcane power. If successful, lose a healing surge and preserve, otherwise you defile with the power.
Defiler: You always defile, and cannot improve your condition without exceptional means.

You track the progression by making a Wisdom check after each extended rest. If you had defiled since your last extended rest and the check succeeds you are unchanged, and if it fails your conditions worsens. If you have not defiled since your last extended rest and the check succeeds your condition improves, and if it fails you are unchanged.

Reaching the Preserver condition might only be possible with a feat, but it allows a character to opt-out of the condition tracking if they desire. If the DCs are designed carefully it might allow a person to play a terribly conflicted character for an extended period of time, rather than inevitably falling to one extreme or the other in a single day.

I'm definitely interested to see how WotC handles defiling.

 

[fba827]

I think tracking thirst and hunger in 4e would actually be very easy and mesh perfectly with the system.

Players: we want to take an extended rest.
GM: How much water do you have, and what was the last thing you ate?

You know what (random thought) -- if they do it like the disease condition track then it would be very easy to incorporate....