I've got the 3.5 PHB in front of me

Endur · Jun 10, 2003

Thanks Roy!!

Tom

John Crichton · Jun 10, 2003

L0rd_Dark0n said:
Does anyone know if 3.5 will be using Wound and Vitality points instead of just Hit Points?

I don't have the book but I think I can safely say that the HP is used, not WP/VP...

coyote6 · Jun 10, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Power Attack and Die Hard

jasamcarl said:
Again, i'm also under the impression that Attack bonuses for monsters (especially at high levels) have also gone up. AC might also have a greater value.

Loss of a shield is, at most, a loss of 7 AC; high-level monsters already have sufficiently high attack bonus that characters like the Iconics will get hit. Higher attack bonuses ought to make the lower AC even less relevant.

So, if Two-Hand Man gets 2-for-1 for Power Attacks, do they get 2-for-1 for Combat Expertise?

L0rd_Dark0n · Jun 10, 2003

John Crichton said:
I don't have the book but I think I can safely say that the HP is used, not WP/VP...

Why is that? Is it just to make it more backwards compatible with 3E? Also, has anyone heard if there will be class dodge bonuses like in Star Wars?

coyote6 · Jun 10, 2003

L0rd_Dark0n said:
Why is that? Is it just to make it more backwards compatible with 3E? Also, has anyone heard if there will be class dodge bonuses like in Star Wars?

IIRC, someone from WotC (Ted Stark, AV, Andy Collins -- someone) said that 3.5e wouldn't have VP/WP, or general class-based Defense bonuses (monks & I guess dwarven defenders and the like will still have their AC bonuses).

You might look for those in Unearthed Arcana, but I imagine we're at least 3-4 months before we start getting hints about that book (beyond what slipped already -- it's a book of variants, which is why I wouldn't be shocked to see VP/WP or the like).

BryonD · Jun 10, 2003

The PA logic

This is as I understand it and I don't claim to speak for anyone.

Imagine two characters, one with STR13 Dex18, so he just qualifies for PA and the other with STR 18. The STR18 guy uses a 2 handed weapon and the other guy is using a finesse weapon.

Assume everything else is comparable.

The STR13 guy gets a +1 damage bonus.
The STR18 guy gets a +6 damage bonus.

They both have the some attack bonus. So the STR13 guy actually benefits better from PA. His chance that a hit will turn into a miss is the same. He perk for hitting is the same. But his penalty if the hit becomes a miss is more than 5 points less (5 for STR bonus and the 2H weapon will have a higher base damage).

So PA actually rewards marginal STR guys. The change gets rid of the PA plus finesse thing (a change I like), unless you use a rapier (I can not think of any other off hand, perhaps I forget). And, the change makes the feat a true power smashing feat like it is supposed to be.

That said, I think they over did it. But I found it easier to swallow after I thought about it this way some.

John Crichton · Jun 10, 2003

L0rd_Dark0n said:
Why is that? Is it just to make it more backwards compatible with 3E?

Not only that, but all the spells mentioned do HP damage, the ranger class has a d8. These are all HP, not WP/VP.

That and HP is one of those things that I believe will always be in D&D. But that's just an opinion. The above we already know.

Ankh-Morpork Guard · Jun 10, 2003

Olive said:
Except with that Cosmopolitan feat from FRCS... pretty exceptional circumstances tho.

But that isn't Core. And anyway, it has a Regional requirement in the Realms anyway...and when I run Realms games, I stick to those requirements.

As for the VP/WP and the class based Defense bonus...it doesn't work for D&D. To use VP/WP you would have to completely rework every single attack or damage dealing spell in the book, and THAT would be a new edition...NOT a Revision. Class based Defense...well, that's needed for Star Wars and d20 Modern because armor isn't as common, and doesn't provide huge bonuses. D&D doesn't need it, because of the myraid of spells, armor, etc.

John Crichton · Jun 10, 2003

coyote6 said:
You might look for those in Unearthed Arcana, but I imagine we're at least 3-4 months before we start getting hints about that book (beyond what slipped already -- it's a book of variants, which is why I wouldn't be shocked to see VP/WP or the like).

Probably not. Monte doesn't like VP/WP. Plus, the system is interchangable with D&D meaning HP will have to be used.

Ankh-Morpork Guard · Jun 10, 2003

John Crichton said:
Probably not. Monte doesn't like VP/WP. Plus, the system is interchangable with D&D meaning HP will have to be used.

Methinks he was talking about the rumored Unearthed Arcana, apparently a book of varients by WotC...not Monte's Arcana Unearthed. Though, I don't see VP/WP being presented as a variant, because of the sheer amount of work it would take. That would require an entire book to itself.