5E Jeremy Crawford Discusses the Wild Soul Barbarian and Path of the Astral Self Monk

Parmandur

Legend
Jeremy Crawford sat down with Todd Kendrick to discuss the latest UA. The two ideas were the ideas of Ben Petrisor, and Crawford confirmed the Anime influence. He said they have covered most of the standard D&D tropes at this point in the editions life, and that they felt that it was time to explore some "high magic" concepts that dipped into psychedelia. Frankly, I got the vibe that he may have been coy about what this might be for that they have in the works.

 

Kobold Avenger

Adventurer
I really like the crazy ideas too, and I think they should keep them coming.

Wild Soul Barbarian is not quite the Rage Mage prestige class of 3e, but it's one I feel is interesting.

And while many felt the Astral Self Monk was based on something from Jojo's Bizarre Adventure, I definitely felt there was a South or Southeast Asian theme to that subclass.
 

Yaarel

Adventurer
For trippy powers, I recommend watching episodes of Legion.

While the genre is superheroes, this particular hero is a telepath that is ultimately able to alter reality itself. (Compare old school wish-like Alter Reality.)

The result is a series of psychedelic vignettes, that actually make sense in hindsight, because of a tight story.
 

Parmandur

Legend
...seriously?
Yes, he said that regarding the core Classes, and he has a point: they did a big character Archetype survey a few years back, and Xanathar's covered most of the top results. With the Artificer, pretty much all if the standard types and tropes are covered. He wasn't saying that there is no room for growth, but that further Subclasses for the core Classes are going to be increasingly niche.
 

Parmandur

Legend
There is still no proper Generalist Wizard.
They made several attempts, which have not been well received. The Generalist is an artifact of 3.x mechanics, really, not a story (he emphasizes the importance of a narrative basis for any Subclass being the consistent feedback in playtest surveys).
 

doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
Yes, he said that regarding the core Classes, and he has a point: they did a big character Archetype survey a few years back, and Xanathar's covered most of the top results. With the Artificer, pretty much all if the standard types and tropes are covered. He wasn't saying that there is no room for growth, but that further Subclasses for the core Classes are going to be increasingly niche.
That survey was pretty garbage, IIRC, in terms of presenting archetypes to choose from.
 
I really like the crazy ideas too, and I think they should keep them coming.

Wild Soul Barbarian is not quite the Rage Mage prestige class of 3e, but it's one I feel is interesting.

And while many felt the Astral Self Monk was based on something from Jojo's Bizarre Adventure, I definitely felt there was a South or Southeast Asian theme to that subclass.
I don't think there is anything wrong with that. Some of my players are big fans of JoJo (which is why I even know about it).

I think the Wild Soul's problem is it isn't based on anything. I think when you design a subclass you need to have a clear idea of your prototype.
 
They made several attempts, which have not been well received. The Generalist is an artifact of 3.x mechanics, really, not a story (he emphasizes the importance of a narrative basis for any Subclass being the consistent feedback in playtest surveys).
The first edition Magic User was a generalist wizard, and it continued to exist in 2nd. And a lot of the negativity towards the Invention wizard was caused by it's Ravnica context being concealed.
 

Leatherhead

Possibly a Idiot.
They made several attempts, which have not been well received. The Generalist is an artifact of 3.x mechanics, really, not a story (he emphasizes the importance of a narrative basis for any Subclass being the consistent feedback in playtest surveys).
The non-specialist as a contrast to a specialist traces it's roots back to the inclusion of the Illusionist, and was properly codified in AD&D.

Most of those attempts were actually testbeds for some entirely absurd mechanics, like the School of Invention being a probe for Ravnica. Which is probably why UA wizards, even the ones crammed with lots of story potential like the Theurge, traditionally don't cross the approval threshold for playtest content. I'm almost entirely sure that the only reason the School of War Magic exists in print is because they had to print a Wizard Subclass for Xanathar's and they ran out of time and ideas for anything else.

And lets face it, those surveys really don't have the level of granularity that they should. The questions are basically "Do you like this?" If enough people (not most mind you, just like 30% or whatever the threshold is) answer 3/5 or less (because being good isn't good enough! it has to be loved~), the entire subclass gets totally scrapped instead of worked on. Even if the reason they didn't like it is because there was that one overpowered ability that they include just to provoke feedback, which obviously needs to be nerfed. Or this armor makes no sense out of context. Or they just don't like the Wizard class in general, so they don't care for any potential Wizard subclass to begin with.
 
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gyor

Adventurer
Jeremy Crawford sat down with Todd Kendrick to discuss the latest UA. The two ideas were the ideas of Ben Petrisor, and Crawford confirmed the Anime influence. He said they have covered most of the standard D&D tropes at this point in the editions life, and that they felt that it was time to explore some "high magic" concepts that dipped into psychedelia. Frankly, I got the vibe that he may have been coy about what this might be for that they have in the works.

I disagree with Jeremy that they have covered all the major Archetypes, not even close.
 

gyor

Adventurer
The non-specialist as a contrast to a specialist traces it's roots back to the inclusion of the Illusionist, and was properly codified in AD&D.

Most of those attempts were actually testbeds for some entirely absurd mechanics, like the School of Invention being a probe for Ravnica. Which is probably why UA wizards, even the ones crammed with lots of story potential like the Theurge, traditionally don't cross the approval threshold for playtest content. I'm almost entirely sure that the only reason the School of War Magic exists in print is because they had to print a Wizard Subclass for Xanathar's and they ran out of time and ideas for anything else.

And lets face it, those surveys really don't have the level of granularity that they should. The questions are basically "Do you like this?" If enough people (not most mind you, just like 30% or whatever the threshold is) answer 3/5 or less (because being good isn't good enough! it has to be loved~), the entire subclass gets totally scrapped instead of worked on. Even if the reason they didn't like it is because there was that one overpowered ability that they include just to provoke feedback, which obviously needs to be nerfed. Or this armor makes no sense out of context. Or they just don't like the Wizard class in general, so they don't care for any potential Wizard subclass to begin with.
The Warmage is actually more popular then many other traditional Wizard schools.
 
I disagree with Jeremy that they have covered all the major Archetypes, not even close.
Agreed. We still haven't got a "physical change whilst raging" barbarian for a start. If they have so run out out of ideas that they start coming up with random silliness they need to hire some new staff.
 

Leatherhead

Possibly a Idiot.
The Warmage is actually more popular then many other traditional Wizard schools.
More popular than any traditional Wizard School.
But that's missing the forest for the trees.

Consider this:
Bladesingers are the most popular Wizard School, and they are a race restricted subclass.
Restricted to the least popular PHB race.
A race that is less popular than most splatbook races.
Additionally, it eats up your PHB+1 pick for organised play.

And despite all that, they are more popular than Warmages. Who in turn are more popular than even the bog-standard Evokers, who were included in the Basic rules. This makes Wizards schools an anomaly. Every other class has a PHB option (if not the Basic Rules option) in their number one slot.

I really don't know how its possible to make it any more clear: The demand for non-Specialist wizards is through the roof. Yes, the Specialist schools were an easy and obvious pick for additional subclass options, but WotC absolutely dropped the ball by not including a Generalist Wizard from day one.
 

Hexmage-EN

Explorer
There are some classic concepts still missing, like the sha´ir or a devoted elementalist. I'd like to take a primordial/archomental as my Warlock patron, too, and beyond reflavoring the Fiend Pact for a fire entity I'm uncertain how to accomplish that.
 

jasper

Rotten DM
Ok, I an old fart. Some the stuff you are mentioning I never heard of. I start back in 1E so what is
Shair?
School of Invention?(sounds like Ravenica )
Artificer (what if get from forums is they create stuff which do spell stuff)
Jolo (I not going to google my mind may not handle the result)
Of course back in the day you could tell my wizard apart from Morrus' wizard. My wizard look like James Bond from the original Casino Royale in a three piece suit and white Persian cat. Morrus' look like the wizard kid from the Saturday morning cartoon but with white hair. :)
 

gyor

Adventurer
There are some classic concepts still missing, like the sha´ir or a devoted elementalist. I'd like to take a primordial/archomental as my Warlock patron, too, and beyond reflavoring the Fiend Pact for a fire entity I'm uncertain how to accomplish that.
Tons of them. It baffles me how Jeremy could actually think that they'd gotten most of them.
 

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