Jericho (New TV Show) - ComicCon Review (Spoilers)

Crothian said:
Isn't denver like 180 miles or so from kansas? Can one actually see a mushroom cloud from that far?


Western Kansas is unbelievably, mind bogglingly flat. Add to that the significant height that Denver has over any given town in the part of the state and the day was clear enough I wouldn't overrule it. Espescially if it was a cloud of large enough mega-tonnage.
 

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OK a couple of things.

First, Denver was always a major nuke target back in the Cold War. Given that we're past that, it might not be as much, but there are still a lot of defense contractors here as well as much of the U.S. Sattelite uplink facilities. The NORAD/Space Command HQ still resides in Colorado Springs (~70 miles from Denver or so). There are also plenty of military bases in the area. It is also about the biggest city for a whole lot of miles. I could see Denver defeinitely being a target of worth.

As for EMP, as I understand it basically you get a wide frequency burst of electro magnetic energy. Electro magnetic waves can generally induce a current in a conductor pretty easily. This is how you make induction furnaces. What an EMP burst will do is cause a burst of current in any conductors. If they are fragile enough (computer chips for example), you will burn out the current pathways by overloading them. Large objects are more likely to be safe since they are more used to dealing with large amounts of current.

Then we have the issue of Kansas, and generators. Well a lot of generators could probably either work as is on ethanol, or with some modification. Kansas, right now, puts out plenty of ethanol. Brazil, for example, runs to a large extent on bio fuels from their farms.

buzzard
 

Brown Jenkin said:
The US system is broken into at least two major grids seperated by the Mississippi but if both Denver and Atlanta are hit then I see no reason that there couldn't be a blackout accross the entire US.
Even if two major metros were hit geographically far apart, you wouldn't see TOTAL power blackout. However, five or six, spread evenly across the country, WOULD do it, for all but the most remote towns in Appalachian and Rocky Mountain valleys who have their own isolated generating stations. Even not counting those, there are actually, I've read in news articles, THOUSANDS of remote farmsteads which run totally off the grid, using combos of wind, solar and water power, but this is a relatively new phenomena within the past twenty years or so.

Now, I can see in the show, reports of a blast in two places, but there actually being MORE, and because of the news blackout, people in Jericho just don't know it yet. It would be a pretty dramatic moment for the series, I imagine, to find out -- it ain't just Denver and Atlanta. New York's gone... and Los Angeles... and Miami... and Chicago...

As for Farm Fuel... note that many farms store diesel fuel for the combines, tractors, back-hoes, etc. with small amounts of gasoline for both some tractors and for small gas engines that start the deisel engines. That won't do your car much good. Plus, farms frequently use "farm grade fuel" (can't remember the exact name they use at the pumps), but it's of lower octane rating than regular stuff, and not as clean, and runs the farm equipment it's designed for just fine - but would tear your car to hell for any length of time.

I agree with the gas stations, though -- if a town pulled together its resources, rationed the gas from the gas stations' tanks (you don't NEED working gas pumps to gas up your car - it just makes it easier), then I could see them doing pretty well for themselves, and one local Wal-mart would offer a HECK of a lot of survival equipment all in one place. :)

So, lots to think about, and lots to hopefully expect, and I'm looking forward to it, myself.
 

Steverooo said:
So, does anyone here know how and why EMPs fry the electronics? I'm no physicist (don't play one on TV, nor even in an RPG), but my understanding is that radiation ionizes parts of the ICs (Integrated Circuit chips), making their function irratic, at best. Thus, anything with ICs is effectively "burned out". Is that about right?

Also, it's my understanding that simple electrical circuits (light bulbs, house wiring, pumps, motors, etc.) should all be okay. Right?

EMP's fry electronics because the intense magnetic field creates an electrical surge. You hear about microprocessors all the time, but that's just because they are a particularly vulnerable component. The pulse will affect any unprotected electrical equipment just like a lightning strike will and more, because it actually induces a massive current. Metal pipes, phone lines, power lines, all that will transmit a sudden sharp current down itself until it reaches some vital component; It'll hurt any device that can be damaged by a huge voltage surge, physically frying materials and such. It'll destroy batteries, explode transformers, melt wiring, all that. Like a lightning strike, the effect on anything is unpredicatable. Some things might work, some might not.

In other words it's going to act just like a tremnedous electrical spike. Blackouts sometimes last days or longer depending on just what has happened. The US electrical grid is actually a great deal ore vulnerable than people think; look at the massive 2003 blackout caused by one station and it's cascading effects. And that's without the added chaos of nuclear war.

If there are multiple points of overload and failure, you can pretty much count on the entire US power grid dying and not coming back. In the event of nuclear war, most of the techs and managers will probably flee their post in order to get to their families; some will not and they may keep order for a short time, but most people are going to leave their job and not come back. There might be a manual means of override, but if there's no-one there to throw the switch...

Most EMPs don't damage a very large area. A nuclear device set off at about 300 km in the air will blanket the entire continental US and more with an EMP but the inverse square law prevents most of that from being damaging. The closer you are, the more damage will occur.

Depending on exact circumstances, a nuclear explosion can disrupt HF radio communications because it affects the ionosphere. Enough disruption and I assume that for a time only line-of-sight communication would be possible.

It's possible to shield a device from an EMP. I'm pretty sure most military devices are sheilded in such a manner; some damage might occur but I think it mitigates a lot of the effect.

This is all presuming it is a nuclear attack. From what Mistwell says, it seems open to debate as to what is really going on. If they are taking inspiration from The Stand, then who knows what could really be going on.
 

WayneLigon said:
It's possible to shield a device from an EMP. I'm pretty sure most military devices are sheilded in such a manner; some damage might occur but I think it mitigates a lot of the effect.

Yes, most military equipment is shielded against EMP. In fact as a curious bit of information, the largest wooden structure in the world made without any nails or screws is at Kirland AFB in Albuquerque. This is used by Sandia National Laboratories to test military equipment for EMP hardness. It is a huge scaffolding large enough to hold a B-52 all made from wood, including the fasteners which are pegs in sockets.

Before 9-11 people were able to get onto the base and see some of the funky stuff even if you weren't military or emploted by DOE. I don't believe this to be the case anymore.
 

Steverooo said:
Was it a nuke, or not? Do we really know, for sure?

No, we do not. It was a mushroom cloud seen in the distance in the general direction of Denver, and an answering machine message from Atlanta that suddenly went dead with the sound of someone exclaiming "Oh my god, what is that" and then the sound of a boom, glass breaking, and a dead line.

We do not know anything beyond that, other than some dead birds.

If it WAS a nuke, then there was an EMP, and anything electronic (as opposed to electrical) is fried, and you'll need new chips (generally) to repair it. (In some cases, depending upon the chip and damage, a knowledgable person might be able to repair it... I couldn't, but it is sometimes possible.)

If it was a nuke, the EMP would not have likely reached the town of Jericho. It's not THAT close.

If it wasn't really a nuke, then I don't know why power is out, unless the lines are down (which is very possible, in an explosion). Phones operate under their own power, so the electricity has no effect on them. If the phone company has no power, though, no phones. Cell nets I don't know anything about.

The power did not end simultaneously with the mushroom cloud. It took some time (a half hour maybe?) before it went out. We do not know why. One character mentions that it might not be out, just overloaded from the loss of Denver generating stations.

Batteries are really no problem. even a small town probably has hundreds, in the stores, and more almost dead ones laying all about, throughout the town. And that's without any recharging (I have quite a few crank- or solar-powered rechargers, as well as the kind that plug into the wall, and that's without using a 12-volt battery to recharge a bunch of 1.5 volts).

That's cool. I've never seen a crank-based battery recharger. That sounds useful.

Not really. The gas stations still have gas, the PUMPS just won't work without power (no electricity). You can syphon a bit of fuel out of the hose, without any special gear.

Sure, they have some gas. But for how long? With no tank refills (and I mean the underground tanks) they will eventually run out. And since they will need to eat, the farm equipment will need to use most of that to maintain the farms to feed the town probably. But you're right, there is gas for now, and some travel is possible, and I think we will see that during the season.

With a little preparation time, and a working vehicle, I could haul a battery and an inverter up to the station, find the guy who runs the place, and get the voltage/amperage that the pump needs, and then power the pump from the batteries/alternater & inverter, and get all the fuel that we had storage containers for... As long as the vehicle ran, we could charge the batteries from the alternater...

I don't think it's an issue with the pumps. This is a relatively small, relatively old town. They may not even use an electronic pump.

Unlike the electronics, the EMP wouldn't fry copper coils of wiring. Motors, light bulbs, etc., should still work, if you have power to run them. Does the ol' "crazy guy" have solar panels? :p Let's hope SOMEONE in Jericho does! :D

I have not seen any solar panels ion the pilot. But I am pretty sure there was no EMP that hit the town.
 

Brown Jenkin said:
A nuke in Denver tends to indicate an ICBM strike from a major power, terrorists, or possibly just an accident. If it is an ICBM strike then in all likelyhood there would be many more than the one cloud seen as the enemy would likely be striking military facilities as well.

Based on the message from Atlanta, that was actually hinted at, that there was more than one strike.

There would also probably be some indication in the news that tensions were running high with another major power.

They made a point of stressing early in the episode, on every TV, that some sort of military crises was taking place and the President had assembled an emergency joint session of Congress to talk about it.

With only one cloud the terrorist or accident theory have stronger likelyhood.

There is no other major, or even minor, city within visual distance of Jericho it appears. It very well may have been thousands of nukes, and they just only saw the one. They made a point of showing that Jericho was in the middle of nowhere in Kansas.

With either the terrorist or accident theory then in all likelyhood there is only one or a very small number of cities hit at once and most of the rest of the country wouldn't be in a post apololyptic scenario yet. If the concearn is about the actual enemies knowing about Jericho then I don't buy it at all.

One character does mention that they should paint out the name of the town with black paint on their police cars before going out, since they don't want people to know that Jericho is still okay, in case there are enemies out there.

See above. My question is what "Enemy" are they trying to keep secret from? Without more mushroom clouds I doubt that the US is some post-apocalyptic nightmare or that there are Russian/Chinese/Alien troops running all around Kansas.

We don't know.

CB radio/Shortwave radio. The other means of communication are probably down with the power. It looks like a pretty big town though so someone will likely make a drive sooner rather than later. There would also likely be a minor exodus and influx as people try to leave to get to relatives and the surrounding farmers all come into town to see what is going on.

Yeah the writer hinted that there are other peope around that they will find soon, including probably an indian reservation.

Sure why not. Its not like Denver isn't upwind anyway and anything radioactive in that cloud will be heading right to Jericho. If radiation is a concearn the best bet would be to drive north or south depending on the wind direction. Maybe head down to Oklahoma City (about the same distance) and see what is going on. If all the cities are hit then pool the gas and cars and convoy up to Canada since it won't be long until Jericho is just as contaminated as everything else. See above. OK heading to Denver is a bad idea but what about heading to Oklahoma City, Witchita, Omaha, Kansas City all of which are away from Denver. As above, if Denver is a radioactive wateland then Jericho won't be much longer with the winds heading from west to east. The longer you stay and decide what to do the more radiation you will get. My guess would be that with only one cloud seen it is limited in nature and heading north or south as soon as possible would be a good idea. If it is nukes all across America it doesn't much matter as it is now radioactive-postapocolyptic endgame anyway and pretty much everyone is screwed no matter where you are.

The writers said they studied wind patterns and will deal with the issue of radiation fairly early in the show. That's not to say there will be radiation or not, just that they will offer an explanation of some sort.

The way I see it is that this is trying to be another Lost with drama and unsolved mysteries. However right now I can see too many holes in just the preview to really be interested. Oh and if it/they are not nukes but some non-radioactive super science bombs then I am out as well.

What holes are you seeing? So far all that has happened is that they saw a mushroom cloud in the direction of Denver (no holes), and have an answering machine message indicating something may have happened in Atlanta (no holes) and the US was in the midst of some sort of unspecified emergency military issue (no holes) and the power went out for any of a variety of reasons (no holes). So, what is your issue ALREADY with this show you have not even seen?
 
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Abraxas said:
Of course it is perfectly normal in a small town in rural Kansas for someone to have a geiger counter :D

and trying desparately to get somewhere where somebody knows whats going on.

They do have a small number of geiger counters. It takes them a while to dig out the box in the police station that has them. And they look a bit old, and obviously kinda hard to test them. But they do pull them out and try them and they detect no radiation.
 

Shalimar said:
It sounds a lot like the Stirling trilogies "Island on the Sea of Time" and the "Dies the Fire". Both outstanding sets of books.

I liked the premise of the books; hated the execution. I sold the "Island" trilogy as soon as I finished it, and didn't complete the first book in "Dies the Fire". Stirling's superhuman survival characters just annoyed the crap out of me.

That's all.
 

Crothian said:
Isn't denver like 180 miles or so from kansas? Can one actually see a mushroom cloud from that far?

They do not know for sure it is Denver. It's in the direction of Denver, and there is a mountain there, and they see a relatively tiny mushroom cloud there, and some buses on the highway outside of town seem to feel some sort of blast but it's actually unclear if they felt a blast or if the drivers were just so distracted by the cloud and the radio dying that they accidentally crashed.

It's not the kind of sky-dominating mushroom cloud we've seen in prior movies and TV shows. It's quite far in the distance. I will see if I can find a screen shot of it.
 

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