Ilbranteloth
Explorer
So much great stuff from [MENTION=16586]Campbell[/MENTION] and [MENTION=42582]pemerton[/MENTION], both of which I think I'll address here too...
What [MENTION=29398]Lanefan[/MENTION] is describing here is closer to how things function in my campaign. I will admit that the nature of my games has an awful lot to do with what I like, and the way my brain works. I tend to dig deep into just about anything that interests me, and that pretty much always leads off into tangents that I also dig into. That includes world-building aspects, story-building aspects, and rules too. I like them to all work together.
I have spent a lot of time both learning and detailing what I use in the Realms. And I use a lot of it. I've considered the majority of the games (and certainly all of the Forgotten Realms campaigns) that I've run as part of one campaign. The events and characters from games I ran in the late '80s still show up or have an impact on the current games. They could be legends, sometimes ancestors, and other times still exist. Things that I wrote up decades ago, often come into play in the present campaigns.
But really it comes down to what we prefer as an in-game experience. My players (and we've had discussions, and in many cases tried other systems) like the (essentially) AD&D approach where they know what they need to know as their characters, and the DM handles the rest. I get that it's sort of a self-fulfilling approach, because when I (and some of my players join me) run a public game, even with different approaches, they tend to invite the ones that seem like they will fit our play style best back to the home game. Most of these public games also tie into the home campaign, and characters (and players) have moved from one group to another.
So when we're looking for new players, we're looking for players that will fit in well with what we do. Likewise, when we start new players, we're invariably teaching the game in the way we like to play it. How that fits into the greater world of RPG innovation really doesn't matter to us. It just matters that we're having a good time.
I consider myself an enthusiastic hack. But I have a lot of former players (usually due to scheduling issues) that end up playing in other games, then coming back to me to discuss why it's not working as well, or why it's not as much fun, or what they've been doing to try to teach the others. I'm not saying I'm a great DM, or necessarily better than anybody else. Only that for the people that play in my campaigns like the way I (and we) play. And to me, that's the point. If people want to come back to your campaign, or reminisce about how great it was, or even attempt to emulate your play styled, you must be onto something. That this has been the case for 30+ years now, I think I'm onto something that works for me. It might be a very small percentage of the gaming population, but it's more than enough for the time that I can afford to devote to it.
I do enjoy learning more about how other DMs and other game systems work. I'll steal whatever seems to fit. Perhaps my willingness to try new things and approaches, to look for ways to improve my skills, and improve the game for the players is part of that. When I started looking more into BW/DW (because of this forum), we looked at it in some detail, but the group decided the approach didn't fit what they liked. So I could give up some of my D&D time to go try another game, but I'd rather just play D&D. From the late '70s to the early '90s I tried just about every other game that was released. Since the whole group couldn't get together several times a week, a smaller part of the group that loved checking out and trying other things would get together to try them. Whether it was another TSR game world, or another RPG altogether, we tried a lot. The fantasy ones we tended to like the least, since they didn't really fit what we liked in our fantasy RPG.
Many others have suggested a similar approach. For me, I love the detailed histories and such. They help my brain function to tie things together, bring more ideas into the world, and bring the world to life. Knowing the history of a sword provides some context when they find it, like when Frodo gained Sting. In addition, it's just the way my brain works. I don't expect the players to feel the same, but they do enjoy being able to count on me when they do dig into the history of an object, place, event or person. I wouldn't recommend the approach to everybody, but if you're like me, writing material behind the scenes (even if you don't write it down or bring it into play) can be very rewarding.
Yes, but the more you know about something the more you can meaningfully cover it.
Yep, and mine lie in world-building, rule-building, and many more. My players tend to be passionate about their characters, and the story they are writing with them. They tend not to have much of a world-building slant to it, they don't want to influence that part of the game, instead they want to experience it as their characters.
Since we're not great acting-type role-players, it's the richness of the setting, the locations, the dungeons, the schemes and mysteries, and things that like that make it feel more authentic and less designed. This flows into our rules as well. For example we don't have issues with 5-minute work days because they treat their characters as people, who like things like sleep, and breaks from work, and food, and a reasonable amount of effort during a given day. I've also modified the rules to support that approach too. The mundane things, the bits of life that make it feel more "realistic" whether it be rules, setting, or interactions, is what helps ground them in the game, makes them feel more immersed in their character within the world.
I'd say we are exploring the characters within their setting. The setting is as important a "character" as the characters, NPCs and story. I'd equate it to comparing Star Wars and Star Trek. Both are science fiction stories, but the setting has a dramatic effect on the characters and stories.
We aren't afraid to fix an inconsistency, but we won't typically replay it. They do own their characters, and they own as much of the fictional world as their characters impact.
We try not to let problems stop the flow of the game however, and wouldn't want to call each other out. That's probably one of the biggest reasons we have found that we don't like the BW/DW style of play. We prefer to maintain the immersion within the story. That is, the players maintain their immersion within their character, instead of shifting from character to world-building, to potential discussions about how or why that can't or shouldn't happen, or it contradicts this, etc. Likewise, I'm typically not doing much world-building within the course of the game. Certainly, as a DM, improvisation is always part of the game. But by having a thorough understanding of the NPCs and their goals, the events that are occurring in the region, the lay of the land, and things like that. Even the typical behavior of monsters, etc., means that I can also focus on the creation of the story during the game, reacting to the characters and their actions.
Outside of the game session I don't have any problem with as much input from the players as they want to give. But within the game we expect to be within the scene, and within the moment, with them as their characters and nothing else.
While there are certainly times when I have to address a player directly, and there is a blend between player/character, and recognizing that we use a more descriptive approach rather than "in character acting," they players do not shift out of their in-character perception. That is, they approach the game as a character experiencing the story, rather than a player playing a character that is experiencing the world, or third person. But that's largely because the players aren't part of the framing. I might ask them where they are standing, and certainly what they do, but the answer is almost always "I...something." A "how does that relate" moment exists only if another character asks. Otherwise what's going on in a character's head stays in that character's (player's) head.
The bottom line is, we have different goals, and we find what works best for us to meet our goals. I won't begin to pretend that my way is the "right way" nor that everybody should be doing it this way. It's just the approach we enjoy.
