Jumping over Opponents

[eudemonist]

By the rules, you are correct. Like I said, we have a house rule that allows jumping via Acrobatics as well, both because of this fluff and because it fits our notion of common sense. Leaping seems like an integral part of acrobatics, to me.

Once we determine if the character can make the jump (via a successful jump check), all other normal movment rules apply.

 

[Squire James]

As I see it, there's 2 ways to jump over something: brute-force Athletics, or Acrobatics stunt. Athletics is very tough unless the foe is only 3 feet tall. Acrobatics stunt may be the way to go here. Of course, if the monster is TOO big it may be more accurate to call it a Climb check...

 

[James McMurray]

James McMurray when you use Stunt and you fail you will end prone anyway.

I don't have my books with me. Where is this rule at?

 

[CapnZapp]

Another thing. I will rule it will still provoke opportunity attack. Whats your ruling CapnZapp?

Agreed - the text says nothing like "this makes you ignore OAs".

(If you wish to avoid OAs, you'll have to use Athletics to make a really high jump, so you clear the square above the monster as well)

 

[CapnZapp]

I agree that the half oppoenent's level and size modifiers work out nicely. But to be pedantic the DMG p42 rule suggests half the character's level, so jumping over that level 1 minion will get harder as you go up in level (well basically your own half level is added to the DC 15).

You're right.

Personally, though, I find that to be silly. Not to speak about how disheartening it is as a player to know every challenge mercilessly scales with your own abilities. Makes everything always the same difficulty.

I understand the underlying idea, but I prefer to apply this only to things where the general "level" of the surroundings is the same as the level of the characters. For instance, if a paragon tier party travels to the Underdark, I have no problem with throwing "paragon difficulty" terrain at them.

But somersaulting over a peasant should be the same difficulty at level 1 as at level 30.

Having the DC depend on the character level is clearly inappropriate. And remember it's not me who suggested using the DMG tables - I have always advocated adding in a formula directly in the Acrobatics description.

A formula that reads DC 15 + opponent's half level.

 

[CapnZapp]

because monsters stopping a PC shouldn't really be possible

May I ask you why?

Saying things like "the Ogre blocks your path, you need to use a trick/skill/power to get past him without killing him" sounds like a very reasonable and natural DM call... at least to me.

 

[CapnZapp]

Fluff text for a Skill really matters very little. You are physically making a jump and it would therefore follow all of the rules for Jumping.

This isn't "fluff text", this is the general rules text of the skill.

Acrobatics allow you to somersault over an opponent, no Athletics necessary, and no Jump rules are involved.

If you need a fluff rationale, here's one (I think was previously mentioned):
- you're using the opponent itself to help you get past him
- the description doesn't necessarily mean you reach a specific height. By "over" you could sail right past his face.
But generally it's best not to mix fluff and rules. The only effect of a successful Acrobatic Stunt check used this way is that your movement can pass your opponent's square. Everything else is up to the DM.

So you're not supposed to be able to use this as a replacement for Jumping to reach high places or objects placed high (unless the DM approves), if that is your concern.

 

[CapnZapp]

As I see it, there's 2 ways to jump over something: brute-force Athletics, or Acrobatics stunt. Athletics is very tough unless the foe is only 3 feet tall. Acrobatics stunt may be the way to go here. Of course, if the monster is TOO big it may be more accurate to call it a Climb check...

The "high jump" rules are incredibly stingy. Especially given a game where Epic characters can destroy entire cities... but they can't make standing jumps much higher than you or me...

That's silly, but also another discussion...

 

[CapnZapp]

I don't have my books with me. Where is this rule at?

Acrobatic Stunt, page 180: "[...]If the stunt fails, you fall prone in the square where you began the stunt (the DM might change where you land, depending on the specific stunt and situation).[...]

Cheers,
Zapp

 

[eudemonist]

If you walk through the square beside him, he can't stop you. Same with the square (cube) above him. Unless he's a fighter, of course, and can stop movement with OAs.