Knowledge: Local?

[dcollins]

Why? Why can't it be "information about areas"?

Because that's not what "Local" means. If the skill were called "Knowledge (demography & folklore)" then I would agree with you, and maybe it should be, but it's not.

 

[Christian]

I tend to think of the "Knowledge (local)" skill as something along the lines of the GURPS 'Streetwise' skill. It doesn't apply only to your hometown, but in places completely outside your realm of experience (eg. in the mysterious lands across the sea), it will be of very limited utility.

 

[DonTadow]

it becomes a useless skill if you have to specify each individual city per Knowledge Local. I use it as a streetwise ability similiar to shadowrun. It lets you know general particular knowledge about any known city similiar to how the other knowledge skills allow you to know things about the general subject. Having someone specify what local is similiar to asking a person to specify what branch of magic they had for knowledge arcana or what denomination for knowledge religion or above ground or below ground for knowledge dungeoneering.

 

[Quickleaf]

Your GM should have informed you of the rule in advance - that's one of the GM's jobs. In situations like this, where I haven't clarified the rule, I usually say "yes" to my players (with the caveat that next time they'll need to follow the rule). It seems like your GM is in the habit of saying "no" in such circumstances. I would make sure that your GM lets you know about any rules interpretations in advance.

Here's my answer to a related question: How do I adapt a Knowledge skill I already have upon arriving in a new place?

http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=139184

 

[Jdvn1]

Because that's not what "Local" means. If the skill were called "Knowledge (demography & folklore)" then I would agree with you, and maybe it should be, but it's not.

But based on the description of the skill, it is (demography & folklore) and more.

Either you're focusing too much on the name of the skill rather than what it is or you need to introduce Knowledge (Demography & Folklore) into your game.

 

[Jdvn1]

Your GM should have informed you of the rule in advance - that's one of the GM's jobs.

Agreed. Ask your GM if you can swap it out for something more pertinent.

 

[Pasus Nauran]

Agreed. Ask your GM if you can swap it out for something more pertinent.

Yeah, I've already done this. He generally doesn't have problems with making such changes just after a character decision is made if it doesn't make sense or whatever.

I just find the restriction to be very odd, and contrary to the way all other Knowledge skills work.

 

[Tonguez]

I've always assumed it works this way. Honestly, it seems counter-intuitive for it to work any other way.

personally I don't see it as counter-intuitive to run K:Local as applying (almost) everywhere

PCs are by nature 'cosmopolitan' people - they are literate, widely travelled and have bits of knowledge about a broad range of topics - therefore they probably know bits about lots of different localities especially when it comes to major cities

As an illustration I've also pointed to the example of Marco Polo, his writings about Asia were widely read in Italy such that the people of Italy knew about legends, personalities, inhabitants, laws, customs, traditions, humanoids of Asia, even if they had never been there.

Any major area or metropolis can be considered in the same way - in Medieval History widely travelled, literate people probably had some knowledge of the legends, personalities, inhabitants, laws, customs, traditions, humanoids of London, Rome, Paris, Venice, Vienna, Jerusalem and Constantinople (to name a few). Earlier peoples knew about the Library at Alexandria, the the Acropolis of Athens and the Gardens of Babylon

True some of the information may be inaacurate - but who said a skill check has to provide 'true perfectly accurate information'.
One last thing though I also don't think K:Local can tell the PC where to find the best deal on mules in the city - thats a Gather Info check, K:Local can tell me yep the places has many elves who beielve they were descended from the stars and thus follow the Church of Zek .The city of Zek is governed by the Emir Abdul-Zim
(of course when the PCs go to find the Emir they may discover that he has been dead for 15 years having been executed for heresy - and now the PCs are under suspicion!)

 

[Quickleaf]

PCs are by nature 'cosmopolitan' people - they are literate, widely travelled and have bits of knowledge about a broad range of topics - therefore they probably know bits about lots of different localities especially when it comes to major cities

An excellent point, but also an assumption. In a more local campaign, which treat KL as a group of separate cultural skills, I think it would be fair to allow Bards and well-traveled characters to take a feat which allows KL to operate universally.

As an illustration I've also pointed to the example of Marco Polo, his writings about Asia were widely read in Italy such that the people of Italy knew about legends, personalities, inhabitants, laws, customs, traditions, humanoids of Asia, even if they had never been there.

Great point Tonguez! I would also add that literacy was fairly uncommon and most people learned about such things through word of mouth. Often, a storytellers objective was to entertain or confirm a pre-existing bias (e.g. those Orientals are all sex-crazed fiends! or some other Bull Of course, in Baghdad they're saying the same thing about Marco Polo). Thus, KL about other cultures could be quite inaccurate. One way to represent this without forbidding using the skill would be to rule that all KL checks pertaining to a foreign culture which fail by more than 5 provide misinformation instead.

Any major area or metropolis can be considered in the same way - in Medieval History widely travelled, literate people probably had some knowledge of the legends, personalities, inhabitants, laws, customs, traditions, humanoids of London, Rome, Paris, Venice, Vienna, Jerusalem and Constantinople (to name a few). Earlier peoples knew about the Library at Alexandria, the the Acropolis of Athens and the Gardens of Babylon

Indeed, I would say that being in a major metropolis should affect the KL skill, say allowing someone who couldn't normally make a KL check about a foreign place to do so, because there is just so much information going around. Actually, the way Atlas Games handles this in Dynasties & Demagogues is to allow Gather Information checks to be made about foreign places when one is in a metropolis.

One last thing though I also don't think K:Local can tell the PC where to find the best deal on mules in the city - thats a Gather Info check,

I disagree. You really can argue it would be either skill. KL would represent you knowing customary prices and standards of trade, and also personalities/inhabitants likely to give you the best deal. Gather Info could represent you asking people who already have KL about the best place to buy a mule.

K:Local can tell me yep the places has many elves who beielve they were descended from the stars and thus follow the Church of Zek .The city of Zek is governed by the Emir Abdul-Zim (of course when the PCs go to find the Emir they may discover that he has been dead for 15 years having been executed for heresy - and now the PCs are under suspicion!)

How can I just picture a GM doing this on a failed KL check?

 

[nittanytbone]

Perhaps you could apply a -2 circumstanial modifier when the PC is out of a familiar area. After some time in the new region (maybe a month) and maybe some gather information checks, the PC is considered acclimated: he's met the important folks, knows where the best taverns are, etc.

If you take a party-hopper out of his local scene, he'll be disoriented for a bit but will catch on to the new area pretty quick.