D&D General Languages in D&D Are Weird, Let's Get Rid of Them.

[Micah Sweet]

I haven't read the entire thread, so forgive me if I cover ground already trod . . .

When the heroes struggle to communicate with the other characters they meet, friend, foe, or unknown, it creates tension and story opportunity. When they discover strange writing none of them can read, again, tension and opportunity.

Removing languages from D&D would be a mistake. But the way they are handled currently isn't that great, and I really don't like the way they are handled in the new Character Origins playtest document.

IMO, even in standard PHB D&D, there needs to be more world-building and the use of a "culture" category, which languages would be tied to. You could choose the elf race, then choose the high elf, wood elf, or dark elf culture, each with it's own language. Ideally, I would also try to create some culturally specific backgrounds for each race to hit those classic archetypes . . . but of course, players could customize and mix ancestries (race), cultures, languages, and backgrounds.

No more monolithic racial languages such as "elf". Three major elven cultures are described in the PHB, why shouldn't each have their own cultural traditions and languages? Same with dwarves, orcs, and everybody!

Of course, the problem then shifts to humans. There is no "human" language (unless you count common). And traditionally, humans are described as culturally diverse, but rarely are examples given in the PHB . . . its saved for setting books. I would like to see some human cultures detailed somewhat in the PHB, each with their own language.

Maybe WotC just needs to finally break down and marry the core D&D books with the Forgotten Realms setting, and use the cultural groups of the Realms in the PHB.

I believe the cultural groups of the Realms actually are listed in the PH, for what it's worth.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Realistically that is true. But is it fun or practical in a game?

IMO too much has already been sacrificed on the altar of "fun and practical in a game".

 

[Henadic Theologian]

The languages in D&D are going to matter a lot more now they at least some of them are being developed for the D&D movie (and likely future movies & TV shows, maybe video games and books too).

 

[Sanguinarious]

You could also assume a spaceship crashed on the DnD world abd some bablefish got released into the ecosystem... ;p

 

[Minigiant]

This is why I think D&D needs more languages and some sort of rule for fluency,

For example, Dwarven, Giant, and Northern are all Runic languages. If you speak one, you can communicate in basic conversation in the other 2.

However should you go up to a Dwarven highlord speaking Giant, you'll have trouble saying anything advanced and require a interpreter to get or speak details. But learning Dwarven on downtime if you speak Giant is easier.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

They also give minor spotlight to various character. "Anyone speak goblin? You do? Ember, they are yelling tactics, about how they are all going to rush around to the left go after the cleric."

But I'm back to not liking them if they lock away information. "There's an inscription in draconic along the ancient wall. Anyone read it? No? Okay." Sure, it gives mechanical hooks for abilities, invocations, or spells to allow languages, but meh - I started with not getting much value from specific mechanics about them.

This goes back to being a DM problem, rather than a game design problem.

Things like having a language should be a bonus in an encounter. You can beat the goblins in a fair fight, but you can get tactical knowledge as players, if someone speaks goblin.

You can get your way through the tomb and recover the treasure even if you don't under the inscriptions on the walls, but you can get advantages against trap saving throws if someone is able to translate them.

Locking away information in an RPG with only a single pass/fail solution is bad design, full stop. But that's not the fault of WotC if a DM does that.

 

[Maxperson]

This is why I think D&D needs more languages and some sort of rule for fluency,

For example, Dwarven, Giant, and Northern are all Runic languages. If you speak one, you can communicate in basic conversation in the other 2.

However should you go up to a Dwarven highlord speaking Giant, you'll have trouble saying anything advanced and require a interpreter to get or speak details. But learning Dwarven on downtime if you speak Giant is easier.

That doesn't make sense, though. Dwarves don't speak any sort of dialect of giant. It's not even close. They use the runes, but that's like writing down what I'm typing here in spanish and expecting me to have even an inkling of what was said just because they use the same runes(lettering).

I don't mind a fluency system, but I'd rather it be something like... You are fluent in your racial language and common. If human you are fluent in common and a language of your choice. Any further languages spoken due to background, feats, etc. are at rank 1(basic) and allow for limited communication. Each level you get 1 rank point to add to a language of your choice, either a new one or in an existing language below rank 3.

Rank 1: basic ability(can communicate with difficulty)
Rank 2: Intermediate ability(Can communicate well, but will have the occasional hiccup)
Rank 3: Fluent(can communicate freely)

 

[Minigiant]

That doesn't make sense, though. Dwarves don't speak any sort of dialect of giant. It's not even close. They use the runes, but that's like writing down what I'm typing here in spanish and expecting me to have even an inkling of what was said just because they use the same runes(lettering).

I don't mind a fluency system, but I'd rather it be something like... You are fluent in your racial language and common. If human you are fluent in common and a language of your choice. Any further languages spoken due to background, feats, etc. are at rank 1(basic) and allow for limited communication. Each level you get 1 rank point to add to a language of your choice, either a new one or in an existing language below rank 3.

Rank 1: basic ability(can communicate with difficulty)
Rank 2: Intermediate ability(Can communicate well, but will have the occasional hiccup)
Rank 3: Fluent(can communicate freely)

No one actually speaks Giant or Dwarven in real life so they could easily be made into being similar with the same root.

An actual leveled fluency system would be great as an optional rule but too much for the base rules.

 

[Maxperson]

No one actually speaks Giant or Dwarven in real life so they could easily be made into being similar with the same root.

Not without destroying who and what D&D dwarves are. I mean, do you really think the dwarven gods would create the dwarves and say, "Surprise! You speak the language of giants, our and your most hated enemies!"?

 

[Jfdlsjfd]

I don't know if asking how does one deal with language in a game set on Earth will derail the thread or provide useful insight. Like, CoC or in police procedural games.