Line spell question

[Dracorat]

I know this has been discussed from time to time, but it has been a while and I need a refresher for a debate I promised one of my players.

Consider that the following diagram represents 4 squares on a grid. The letters are intersections and the numbers are identifiers for the squares themselves.

A - B - C
| 1 | 2 |
D - E - F
| 3 | 4 |
G - H - I

If I cast a line spell (like Lightning Bolt) from Intersection D to Intersection F, which squares are affected? How about one from G to C? And finally, one from D to C? (I ask this last one as part of the debate I forsee coming. More if it happens.)

Thanks for all responses in advance. =)

 

[pallandrome]

oke doke, I don't generally allow line spells to be cast between squares like that. I consider them to originate from the center of a square.

That being said, G->C would hit 3&2. C->D would hit 1&2. As a rule of thumb, I only include squares that the line goes directly through. If it only hits the corner of a square, that's not enough to count against the fella IN that square.

 

[Hypersmurf]

A line spell specifically starts from a corner of your square, not the centre.

The diagram on PHB p176 shows that any line which passes through point E must affect all 4 squares, so D-F and G-C both affect all four.

D-C is similar to the first two squares of travel in the diagram, and it appears it would only hit squares 1 and 2 (plus, presumably, the undepicted squares above and to the right of 2, if the line continues past intersection C). Square 3 is not affected, because it seems from the diagram that squares that merely touch the originating intersection are excluded.

Line Attacks
A line describes some kinds of attacks (usually magical). It affects creatures or characters in a straight line away from the spellcaster's square to any intersection within range. All squares through which the line passes or touches are affected by the attack. The line continues to its full range, usually beyond the target intersection and possibly affecting more characters or creatures.

Note that this presumes that the above rules supercede the general rules for area spells:
If the spell’s area only touches the near edge of a square, however, anything within that square is unaffected by the spell.

Under this rule, the D-F line only touches the near edge of all the squares it passes; it doesn't pass through any squares at all. The diagram indicates that this is not the behaviour of a Line spell, however, since all four squares surrounding the point marked 'target intersection' are affected, while the line passes through only two of them.

-Hyp.

 

[Dracorat]

That being what it may, that brings me to why I asked about D-C

If simply touching a square is sufficient for that square to be affected (as in the case of G-C affecting all four squares, even though squares 1 and 4 are only 'touched') then why does a caster standing in square 3 not get fried by his own lightning bolt when it starts from intersection D which touches squares 1 and 3 (and the squares immediately left of them too)??

Trying to pin this down. That btw, was the crux of the discussion.

 

[Hypersmurf]

If simply touching a square is sufficient for that square to be affected (as in the case of G-C affecting all four squares, even though squares 1 and 4 are only 'touched') then why does a caster standing in square 3 not get fried by his own lightning bolt when it starts from intersection D which touches squares 1 and 3 (and the squares immediately left of them too)??

As noted above - the diagram seems to indicate that at the point of origin, squares adjacent to the intersection are not affected. Squares that the line passes through are affected; if the line travels along a boundary, those squares will be affected by being adjacent to the next intersection it passes through. But the diagram indicates that at the point of origin, squares that merely touch the intersection are immune.

-Hyp.

 

[Dracorat]

OK Ill have to follow up when I have the diagram on hand. (Too bad the diagram didnt make it to the SRD).

 

[Hypersmurf]

OK Ill have to follow up when I have the diagram on hand. (Too bad the diagram didnt make it to the SRD).

-Hyp.

 

[Dracorat]

Well, that seems pretty clear. It also seems like the spell can be made particularly powerful by making sure you cast lines along straight lines on the battlemat.

 

[Infiniti2000]

If simply touching a square is sufficient for that square to be affected (as in the case of G-C affecting all four squares, even though squares 1 and 4 are only 'touched') then why does a caster standing in square 3 not get fried by his own lightning bolt when it starts from intersection D which touches squares 1 and 3 (and the squares immediately left of them too)??

Besides the diagram Hyp quoted above, consider the logical impact. Making the line affect the origin square(s) would mean that you would always affect yourself on any line spell or spell-like ability. For non-harmless spells, that clearly can't be the intention.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Well, that seems pretty clear. It also seems like the spell can be made particularly powerful by making sure you cast lines along straight lines on the battlemat.

A common house rule to combat that perceived artificiality of the combat grid is to require the caster to choose one side or the other when targeting axially. This doesn't always work, however, because the caster can frequently just choose close corners, effectively achieving the same thing. For example, if the caster is to the left of square 3, instead of targeting D->F, he could choose G->C. The house rule becomes impotent.