Lost

[Rackhir]

The coffin could have been empty because his father's body fell out during the crash, before it landed. Not likely, though, since it wasn't that banged up. More likely, the writers are just messing with us (TM). They're trying to create a sense of ambiguity....which is fine, as long as they really do know the answer beforehand. Twin Peaks greastest failing, IMHO, was that they seemed to have made it up as they went along, so that when they did provide an answer to the initial mystery, it was unsatisfying and (iirc) had inconsistincies with prior clues.

I call it the escalation problem, I think Evangellion also suffered from that to a great extent. Twin Peaks remember wasn't really supposed to be much more than a Mini-Series. In fact an ending was shot revealing who Bob was which they showed in the European broadcast version. So I don't think they did have a plan either, if fact I don't even believe there was much if any planning for the end that they did shoot. Lynch just sort of picked this guy off the set (I think it was the same one who did play Bob later though).

With this sort of show, you have to keep escalating the mystery. It has to be going somewhere, dropped hints and dark suggestions will work for a while, but eventually you have to have them pay off and be resolved/answered in someway.

Now I think someone posted, that they have planned to have partial resolutions at the end of each season and lesser ones scattered over the course of the series which as I believe was supposed to be 3 yrs according to the post. With fortunately provisions made for wrapping things up, if the fickle whims of the public and broadcasters bring it down sooner.

So it sounds like they do have a plan and they do have a point. Hopefully we will be looking at a B5 ending and not a Twin Peaks. Though I did rather like the last scene in the TV series being Coop repeatedly smashing his face into the mirror, while someone was asking "Coop, are you Ok?". And then you see an absolutely maniacally grinning expression on Kyle's face as the blood slowly rolls down his face. Not a great ending, but a great sceen at least. Some people claim that there was a movie made, but I do not believe such lies.

 

[Caius]

must have missed the crate full of dolls, thanks guys for clearing that up. there were pretty freaky though, maybe just cause I hate dolls, give me the creeps

 

[Negative Zero]

If the body was not allowed on the plane, why would they have an empt coffin? It is likely the body was there and got dragged away by wild animals. ...

like i said in my last post: "he may have simply planned to take the empty coffin back to the US, bury it, and either hope no one exhumes it or try to covertly get the body into it at a later date." of course, the wild animal theory makes more logical sense, except that Jack didn't seem to be able to easily get at the coffin. and it didn't seem to have been clawed in any way.

... So, if someone comes up to you and says "I've seen the eye of the island and its beautiful" or what ever it was that Locke said to Jack, wouldn't you ask for a bit more? ...

i thought the same too. but then, he may have been too pre-occupied with his own issues at the time.

... And I don't buy that everyone would sit around and watch someone drown. ...

why not? while i have not seen that particular situation too often in real life, exept for that one time when my cousin and i almost drowned in the exact same way as passenger 47 , in just about every instance that a scene like this is shown on tv, and in my own humble experience, that is exactly what has happened. in a crowd, everyone expects someone else to do it. no one ever wants the responsibility or the risk (which is considerable).

~NegZ

 

[WizarDru]

I call it the escalation problem, I think Evangellion also suffered from that to a great extent.

Yeah, I think you've nailed it right there. I didn't know that Twin Peaks was originally intended as a mini-series. I didn't really get into it at the beginning, and lost it near the middle. I thought it was interesting and moody, but unsatisfying at points, though I can't say for sure quite why.

So far, Lost has impressed me with its writing and characters, so I hold hope out that they aren't going to try a keep the central mystery purely a mystery for an extended period of time. B5 showed that you could reveal the mystery, and then move on from there...which is where I hope they're going. Every episodes, with the exception of the pilot, is supposed to equate to roughly 48 hours, with the first season being the first 40 days on the island (which is supposed to have significance...a Noah reference, perhaps?).


One thing that occured to me: we don't know that he actually got his father's body on the plane. I just assumed it at one point, but as I recall it now, we merely saw him beg, not succeed. He may have just been checking the coffin the way a kid turns on the light, even though he knows there's no monster there. Given what he'd seen up until that point, that's what I'd do.

 

[KnowTheToesToe]

In regards to why people didn't go after the drowning woman - I think Jack says it pretty clearly towards the end of the episode. He comes back from the jungle and states that everyone needs to stop thinking for themselves. That it's obvious that they're going to be on the island for a while and it's time to start working together rather than being individuals. With everyone "looking out for themselves", they are not thinking that other people may need help as well.

 

[Tarrasque Wrangler]

I don't think customs would have just taken a body away and put an empty casket on a plane. They probably boarded the plane not long after Jack's speech to the ticket agent, so I don't think they would have screwed around with calling up a coroner or a funeral home (or whoever gets called in such a case). Besides, if there hadn't been a body on the plane, why would Jack have opened the coffin with such trepidation? Why open it at all if you know it's empty?

I don't think animals got to it either. As has been said, the casket was in pretty pristine condition for having been in a crash, and more importantly, wild boars wouldn't have closed the lid behind them.

 

[WizarDru]

I don't think customs would have just taken a body away and put an empty casket on a plane. They probably boarded the plane not long after Jack's speech to the ticket agent, so I don't think they would have screwed around with calling up a coroner or a funeral home (or whoever gets called in such a case). Besides, if there hadn't been a body on the plane, why would Jack have opened the coffin with such trepidation? Why open it at all if you know it's empty?

Well, unless he brought the coffin in his taxi, chances are that a funeral company or the police brought the body to the airport...but taking just the body back is pretty hard to believe. As for the trepidation about opening it? Well, he had just chased his father through half the jungle...he was probably worried he woudl jump out at him.

 

[Brother Shatterstone]

I rather disbelieve the animals dragged of Jack's dad's body theory... I know of only one animal that would think to close the casket, and I don’t see any of the passengers a) going to that side of the island by themselves and/or b) I don’t see Locke removing the body from a casket.

 

[RedShirtNo5]

The casket

Was there some sign that the specfic casket was for Jack's father or that Jack recognized the casket?

Here's the three explanations I can come up with:

Off camera the ticket agent says something along the lines of "we'll see what we can do." Jack finds the casket, and opens with trepidation, not sure whether it is even his father's casket. Finding it empty, he concludes that it wasn't his father's casket. Angry that he can't give his father's body a burial, he smashes the casket.

Off camera the ticket agent says "Nothing we can do." Jack finds the casket, and opens with trepidation, wondering if the casket was placed on the plane by accident and not sure whether it is even his father's casket. Finding it empty, he concludes that it wasn't his father's casket. Angry that he can't give his father's body a burial, he smashes the casket.

Off camera the ticket agent says "OK, we'll do it." Jack finds the casket, and opens with trepidation, having been wierded out by the hallucinations. Finding it empty, he realizes that he was hallucinating, and concludes that the airline removed the body. Angry that the agent lied, that his father's body was mistreated, and that he can't give his father's body a burial, he smashes the casket.

No matter what the agent said, we don't know whether it was the father's casket, or whether the father's body was in the casket but is missing for normal or paranormal reasons.

Side note: I found the timing of Jack's crying and the discovery of the waterfall interesting.

-RedShirt

 

[satori01]

We could also be talking a veneer of Miracles re: the empty coffin.


1) Dead pop rising from the grave
2) healing of an cripple ala Locke
3) Jacks last name is Sheppard.
and of course my favorite biblical passage:

Big scary invisible dinosaur eats pilot.