LOTR RPG Update

[Sulimo]

I don't know about Tokien Estate freezing ICE's business, but I do know they lost the licence because they took certain liberties that Tolkien Enterprises (from whom they got the licence in the first place) disagreed with.

As far as the Tolkien Estate is concerned, Christopher Tolkien wants absolutley nothing to do with RPG's whatsoever. He is

The Estate had nothing to do with any of it. Its wholly Tolkien Enterprises (TE) which is the company Saul Zanetz setup when he bought the rights to LOTR & The Hobbit from Tolkien.

This is where both ICE and later Decipher got their license from (same with New Line).

ICE didnt lose the license due to any liberties taken. It was wholly about money. ICE lost the license when they went into bankruptcy (just as WEG did with Star Wars).

As for the circumstances of the bankruptcy, ICE employees of the time did say on several occasions that TE essentially forced them into bankruptcy to recover the license...no surprise given the new films were just coming along so being able to sell the license at the time would bring in heaps of cash.

The whole thing was quite distasteful...

They also killed the awesome 'zine Other Hands.

 

[Ranger REG]

That bring up another question...

Most of ICE Middle-Earth product are based on material beyond The Lord of the Rings and the Hobbit. How did they managed to publish such products without permission from Tolkien Estate (who owns author's right to such work like The Silmarillion)?

 

[mattcolville]

That bring up another question...

Most of ICE Middle-Earth product are based on material beyond The Lord of the Rings and the Hobbit. How did they managed to publish such products without permission from Tolkien Estate (who owns author's right to such work like The Silmarillion)?

You'd be surprised what a licensor will let you get away with when they neither have any idea what you're doing, nor do they care.

Once they start caring though, watch out.

 

[rackabello]

don't have the book, but thumbed through it at GenCon. i found myself rather put off that it was illustrated exclusively with stills from the film. while i loved Fellowship..., i couldn't help thinking of Burger King cups seeing one image from the movie after another. maybe it's just me, but i kept looking for the banner that said, "You've read the Book. You've seen the Movie. Now play the Game. And chew the Gum."

it also brings up the discussion in other threads here about roleplaying in such well known fantasy settings: how to prevent the PCs from being overshadowed by the story's true heroes without rewriting the canonic tale?

again, haven't spent more than a minute or two looking at the book. a mere quibble, i'm sure.

 

[Warchild]

Well..hopefully the game will have at least a timeline that extends into the Fourth Age, even if they don't cater to that setting possibility. A lot of people interested in the game seem to be interested in that era. Especially to avoid the meta plot infractures that are sure to come when playing smack dab in the middle of the movie/book timeframes. If they don't at least give you some idea.....i'd be somewhat put out.

 

[Sulimo]

You'd be surprised what a licensor will let you get away with when they neither have any idea what you're doing, nor do they care.

Once they start caring though, watch out.

Oh, I think they knew alright...at least generally. Here's an interview with the Licensing guy at Tolkien Enterprises (or at least during the middle of ICE's time).

 

[mattcolville]

Oh, I think they knew alright...at least generally. Here's an interview with the Licensing guy at Tolkien Enterprises (or at least during the middle of ICE's time).

Laurie Battle isn't a licensing guy, she's a licensing girl.

 

[Sulimo]

Laurie Battle isn't a licensing guy, she's a licensing girl.

Whoops...

 

[Ranger REG]

Does anyone have an interview with Tolkien Estate regarding ICE's use of their copyright and trademarks in their Middle-Earth RPG?

Personally, I don't think it is Tolkien Enterprise's business if ICE uses material outside of LOTR and Hobbit. That's Tolkien Estate's jurisdiction. And if Tolkien Estate is not vigilant about unauthorized use of their material, then it is simply their fault.

Then again, perhaps their inaction to challenge the matter at that time could be interpreted as acceptance or just being under their radar.

 

[mirzabah]

Does anyone have an interview with Tolkien Estate regarding ICE's use of their copyright and trademarks in their Middle-Earth RPG?

Not me...

Personally, I don't think it is Tolkien Enterprise's business if ICE uses material outside of LOTR and Hobbit. That's Tolkien Estate's jurisdiction...

Well, it's all a bit moot seeing as ICE complied with an order to cease publishing all Middle Earth related material and pulp all their ME stock. I don't know who ordered it, but any discussion of ICE and ME has to use the past tense. Very past tense.

Neither Tolkien Estate nor Tolkien Enterprise has particularly covered themselves in glory in their administration of Tolkien's legacy.