Hypersmurf
Moderatarrrrh...
starwed said:
Is it classified as Mind-Affecting?
-Hyp.
Lurk's Mental Assault augment too powerful?
- Thread starter Ashrem Bayle
- Start date
Is it classified as Mind-Affecting?
-Hyp.
Wavestone
Explorer
Hypersmurf said:
I have read through the relevant passages in the Lurk descriptions, and cannot find anything about the augments being Mind-Affecting. Furthermore, they are (Ex) abilities, which feels a little strange when several of the augments involve some obvious spell-like or supernatural effects.. (some examples being ghost touch, planar attack, aligned attack, power drain.. and Mental Assault too.)
Lurk augments probably should include (Ex), (Sp), (Su) and M-Aff notations for each individual augment.
If there ever is some errata on CPsi, this is one of many unclear things that should be covered. While one is at it, the Reach augment could be put back in as well..
Hypersmurf
Moderatarrrrh...
Wavestone said:
In that case, they should affect Undead, Vermin, Oozes, Elementals, and Plants just fine. Constructs, it still won't work on - they're immune to ability damage. (Undead are immune to ability damage to Str, Dex, and Con, but not to mental ability scores.)
-Hyp.
Ashrem Bayle
Explorer
Yep. Doesn't require a sneak attack, and isn't Mind Affecting. Broken? I think so.
Wavestone
Explorer
Mental Assault do look very powerful when looking at it - not mind-affecting, can drop several classes of monsters quickly (animals, beasts..)..
I just read a thread on this subject at the WotC boards, where someone brought up a few points as to why it might not turn out so powerful in practice - Lurks have a d6 HD, weak melee skills, and will really be squished if they miss the augmented attack. They also dont have that many PP to blow on augments - every miss can drain them a lot if they spent much on the augment.
That poster missed one important thing, though - Mental Assault is one of the augments you can use with the feat Ranged Lurk Augment.. 30 ft isn't much, but a lot more doable than trying to attack that Hydra or whatever, closeup..
Even if it technically works on an Ooze or other creature with Int:-, It would be pointless, right? No ability to drain there? (Assuming you go for Int damage..)
Any balancing features I've missed?
I just read a thread on this subject at the WotC boards, where someone brought up a few points as to why it might not turn out so powerful in practice - Lurks have a d6 HD, weak melee skills, and will really be squished if they miss the augmented attack. They also dont have that many PP to blow on augments - every miss can drain them a lot if they spent much on the augment.
That poster missed one important thing, though - Mental Assault is one of the augments you can use with the feat Ranged Lurk Augment.. 30 ft isn't much, but a lot more doable than trying to attack that Hydra or whatever, closeup..
Even if it technically works on an Ooze or other creature with Int:-, It would be pointless, right? No ability to drain there? (Assuming you go for Int damage..)
Any balancing features I've missed?
Hypersmurf
Moderatarrrrh...
Wavestone said:
Right. However, all the Oozes in the Monster Manual have a Wisdom of 1...
-Hyp.
Ashrem Bayle
Explorer
Wavestone said:
True. However, they have access to powers that can buff them considerably. Chances are, a Lurk is going to buff up, sneak up, and land a blow on a flat footed target. If that target is a T-Rex or some other uber-huge/stupid critter, he is going to buff accordingly.
Also, a lurk sniper with the ranged augment feat is a thing to be feared for sure.
Wavestone
Explorer
Hypersmurf said:
My bad.. was going off memory. Thus you can incapacitate an Ooze with Mental Assault by reducing Wis to 0? It does create a weird image in my mind..
Well.. the most logical would be for MA to be mind-affecting - the name says it all!
Making MA mind-affecting and using the caveat of reducing abilities to a minimum of 1, that would kill its usefulness on lowbrow enemies, and make it more or less only useful against caster types. If using that houserule, I'd make it possible to choose Cha damage as well - to not make sorcerers, bards and wilders immune to it.
Still makes it rather inferior at higher levels - you have to sink a lot of PP to make sure casters lose their spells. (ex Wiz with Int 26 - you need to knock off 8 points to even begin to reduce their caster abilites by shutting off access to spell levels)
How does that sound?
Ashrem Bayle
Explorer
I did a little research...
FYI, a 5th level Lurk could take out any of these monsters in one hit:
Any Animal (CR: Varies)
Any Dire Animal (CR: Varies)
Any Animated Object (CR: Varies)
Any Ooze (CR:Varies)
Basilisk (CR:5)
Abyssal Basilisk (CR:12)
Bullette (CR:7)
Chimera (CR:7)
Digester (CR:6)
Frost Worm (CR:12)
Gibbering Mouther (CR:5)
Girallon (CR:6)
Gorgon (CR:8)
Gray Render (CR:8)
Nessian Warhound (Hellhound) (CR:9)
Twelve Headed Pyro-Hydra (CR:13)
Purple Worm (CR:12)
Rast (CR:5)
Shadow Mastiff (CR:5)
Spider Eater (CR:5)
Tendriculos (CR:6)
Those are just the ones from the MMI, and have a CR of 5 or greater.
FYI, a 5th level Lurk could take out any of these monsters in one hit:
Any Animal (CR: Varies)
Any Dire Animal (CR: Varies)
Any Animated Object (CR: Varies)
Any Ooze (CR:Varies)
Basilisk (CR:5)
Abyssal Basilisk (CR:12)
Bullette (CR:7)
Chimera (CR:7)
Digester (CR:6)
Frost Worm (CR:12)
Gibbering Mouther (CR:5)
Girallon (CR:6)
Gorgon (CR:8)
Gray Render (CR:8)
Nessian Warhound (Hellhound) (CR:9)
Twelve Headed Pyro-Hydra (CR:13)
Purple Worm (CR:12)
Rast (CR:5)
Shadow Mastiff (CR:5)
Spider Eater (CR:5)
Tendriculos (CR:6)
Those are just the ones from the MMI, and have a CR of 5 or greater.
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