Mageslayer and invisible opponents

[Aaron]

Does the feat work if your opponent can't see you?

Would a wizard be aware that he can't cast defensively if he doesn't know that you are there, or if he doesn't know where you are?

 

[Hypersmurf]

If you threaten them, they are aware they cannot cast defensively. They might not know why.

Based on the thread title, I thought this was going to be the trickier question of "Do you threaten someone you can't see?" - that is, if the opponent is invisible, can he cast defensively? (Let's say, for example, you have Mage Slayer and can't see invisible, and your buddy can see invisible but doesn't have Mage Slayer - can the evil wizard cast defensively to avoid the AoO from your buddy?)

You can't take an AoO against a creature you can't see... but that doesn't necessarily mean you don't threaten them. For example, if an orc and I stand diagonally around the corner of a corridor from each other, the orc has cover from me - I can hit him (at an increased AC), but I can't make an AoO on him. If my buddy is behind him, does he get a flanking bonus? I'm his ally standing directly opposite, and the orc is in a square into which I can make a melee attack, satisfying the definition of 'to threaten'... so even though I can't make an AoO on the orc, I threaten him and can grant a flanking bonus to my buddy.

Similarly, if the orc is a wizard, despite the fact that I can't make an AoO on him due to cover, he's still in a square I threaten, and thus he can't Cast Defensively due to my Mage Slayer feat.

-Hyp.

 

[Aaron]

For example, if an orc and I stand diagonally around the corner of a corridor from each other, the orc has cover from me - I can hit him (at an increased AC), but I can't make an AoO on him. If my buddy is behind him, does he get a flanking bonus? I'm his ally standing directly opposite, and the orc is in a square into which I can make a melee attack, satisfying the definition of 'to threaten'... so even though I can't make an AoO on the orc, I threaten him and can grant a flanking bonus to my buddy.

Does your buddy get a flanking bonus from you on his turn too?

 

[Hypersmurf]

Does your buddy get a flanking bonus from you on his turn too?

I thought that was what I said?

-Hyp.

 

[RigaMortus2]

Does your buddy get a flanking bonus from you on his turn too?

Read the very last sentence you quoted

 

[Aaron]

I thought that was what I said?

-Hyp.

Even if you can't make any AoO on the orc?

If you can't take AoOs and it's not your turn, are there any squares into which you can make a melee attack?

 

[Hypersmurf]

Even if you can't make any AoO on the orc?

If you can't take AoOs and it's not your turn, are there any squares into which you can make a melee attack?

Let's say you, your buddy, and the orc are in the middle of an open field, so three are no cover or concealment issues.

The orc goes to drink a potion, provoking an AoO; you swing and miss. Now it is your friend's turn.

You've already made your one AoO this round, so you can no longer take any more AoOs until after your next turn. Do you still threaten the orc? Does your friend get his flanking bonus?

-Hyp.

 

[Aaron]

Let's say you, your buddy, and the orc are in the middle of an open field, so three are no cover or concealment issues.

The orc goes to drink a potion, provoking an AoO; you swing and miss. Now it is your friend's turn.

You've already made your one AoO this round, so you can no longer take any more AoOs until after your next turn. Do you still threaten the orc? Does your friend get his flanking bonus?

-Hyp.

This,this , this and this are the reasons why I asked the question above.

 

[Hypersmurf]

This,this , this and this are the reasons why I asked the question above.

There's a difference between the IUS scenario, and the cover/invisibility one.

In the cover/invisibility scenario, nothing prevents us attacking into those squares; thus, even though it isn't our turn, we threaten.

In the IUS scenario, we can attack into squares, therefore even though it isn't our turn, we would threaten... except that unarmed strikes explicitly don't threaten.

-Hyp.

 

[Aaron]

There's a difference between the IUS scenario, and the cover/invisibility one.

But you said that a flat footed character doesn't threaten during his opponent's turn.

You only threaten if you can make an AoO; you can only make an AoO if you threaten... however, we know that because you are flat-footed you cannot make an AoO. Therefore the loop isn't a problem; since you cannot make an AoO, you do not threaten.

Thus I wonder why you should threaten during your buddy turn when your opponent has cover.