Magic Clothes
- Thread starter Clain MacFaileas
- Start date
dcollins
Explorer
It's simple. The rules for creating magic armor (Craft Arms & Armor feat, DMG p. 179-182, etc.) allow the creator you to pick a type of armor to add enhancements and special abilities to. Robes (a) do not apear in the PHB "armor" table, (b) do not appear in the available armor tables on DMG p. 180, and (c) take up a completely distinct slot type from armor on DMG p. 176. (As opposed, to say, a buckler which does appear listed on those tables.) Robes are just not armor, and that's all there is to it -- the fact that magic vestment makes a special exception has nothing to do with permanent magic items.
As usual, there are obvious major advantages if the DM allows armor enhancements to be thrown willy-nilly on anything a player desires. For starters, wizards suddenly get to appear unarmored while their robes give them the equivalent of free glamered armor (normally a +1 bonus special ability).
As usual, there are obvious major advantages if the DM allows armor enhancements to be thrown willy-nilly on anything a player desires. For starters, wizards suddenly get to appear unarmored while their robes give them the equivalent of free glamered armor (normally a +1 bonus special ability).
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Huh?
Well dccollins, how does a Cleric create just your standard +1 magical armor if he doesn't use Magical vestment? I don't see anywhere in those pages how a standard set of armor is enchanted by anyone. It has descriptions on adding in special abilities and what that entails, but it doesn't mention how standard +1 armor is made. The section on creating armor (pg 243) doesn't mention this either. Other items that provide Ac bonuses are listed as using Mage Armor as part of the creation (Bracers of Armor, etc...) I am guessing that Clerics must use Magical Vestment to do so. Since Magical Vestment does mention that clothes can be made into armor, I can see a set of clothes as "armor" that can be further enchanted, as long as they meet the other qualifications. They will still have the inherent weakness of cloth.
Hawkeye
Well dccollins, how does a Cleric create just your standard +1 magical armor if he doesn't use Magical vestment? I don't see anywhere in those pages how a standard set of armor is enchanted by anyone. It has descriptions on adding in special abilities and what that entails, but it doesn't mention how standard +1 armor is made. The section on creating armor (pg 243) doesn't mention this either. Other items that provide Ac bonuses are listed as using Mage Armor as part of the creation (Bracers of Armor, etc...) I am guessing that Clerics must use Magical Vestment to do so. Since Magical Vestment does mention that clothes can be made into armor, I can see a set of clothes as "armor" that can be further enchanted, as long as they meet the other qualifications. They will still have the inherent weakness of cloth.
Hawkeye
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Hypersmurf
Moderatarrrrh...
Re: Huh?
With the Craft Arms and Armor feat...
All you need is Craft Arms and Armor and a caster level of 3x the enhancement bonus you want to imbue.
A wizard with no spellbook, or a cleric with no holy symbol, but access to a magic workshop can make +2 leather armor. He doesn't need any spells to do it, just the right tools, the materials (2000gp worth), the XP, masterwork leather, the feat, and Caster Level 6.
By the rules, he can't do the same with a robe, unless the DM decides to allow a variant item.
-Hyp.
With the Craft Arms and Armor feat...
All you need is Craft Arms and Armor and a caster level of 3x the enhancement bonus you want to imbue.
A wizard with no spellbook, or a cleric with no holy symbol, but access to a magic workshop can make +2 leather armor. He doesn't need any spells to do it, just the right tools, the materials (2000gp worth), the XP, masterwork leather, the feat, and Caster Level 6.
By the rules, he can't do the same with a robe, unless the DM decides to allow a variant item.
-Hyp.
Hypersmurf
Moderatarrrrh...
Remember, Magic Vestment is a transmutation spell, but +1 armor radiates abjuration...
-Hyp.
-Hyp.
And I thought the whole time we were enchanting items, not abjuring them. :b
The Craft Magic Arms and Armor is the rules mechanic that items are created by, but most DMs I know would require Arcane casters to use Mage Armor and Clerics to use Magical Vestment to create standard magical armor. There has to be some focus. If not, why don't casters then just hurl raw magic at each other? I could see that possibly happening with Arcane casters, since they would be more likely to handle raw magic, but I can't see a Divine caster doing it. Guess this is something that just needs to be Rule 0'd.
Hawkeye
The Craft Magic Arms and Armor is the rules mechanic that items are created by, but most DMs I know would require Arcane casters to use Mage Armor and Clerics to use Magical Vestment to create standard magical armor. There has to be some focus. If not, why don't casters then just hurl raw magic at each other? I could see that possibly happening with Arcane casters, since they would be more likely to handle raw magic, but I can't see a Divine caster doing it. Guess this is something that just needs to be Rule 0'd.
Hawkeye
Zhure
First Post
kreynolds said:It's cool. Just a misunderstanding. It happens. At least we're big enough to admit it.
Yup, not a problem. I was assuming you were being a... a... a you-know, because I know you're sharp enough to have worked out the cost, especially with the end result already posted.
If nothing else, I'll attribute it to this really nasty cold making me even less civil than my normal uncivilized self.
Hypersmurf
Moderatarrrrh...
Watch out, Sean K Reynolds will hit you...
How about Druids? Rangers? Paladins?
How about the sorcerer with Craft Arms and Armor, but who hasn't taken Magic Vestment or Magic Weapon as one of his Spells Known?
-Hyp.
dcollins
Explorer
Re: Huh?
As the other poster pointed out, the answer is "with the Craft Arms and Armor feat". Everything else you're adding or asserting is purely house rules, and not supported by the rulebooks, and not used by other players other than your own group.
Look at DMG p. 243, where the detailed rules for "Creating Armor" are printed. You'll notice it has a "special prerequisite" which is based simply on caster level. You'll also notice it then says "If spells are involved in the prerequisities for making the armor..." -- which makes it clear that most of the time, no spells are required at all.
Hawkeye said:
As the other poster pointed out, the answer is "with the Craft Arms and Armor feat". Everything else you're adding or asserting is purely house rules, and not supported by the rulebooks, and not used by other players other than your own group.
Look at DMG p. 243, where the detailed rules for "Creating Armor" are printed. You'll notice it has a "special prerequisite" which is based simply on caster level. You'll also notice it then says "If spells are involved in the prerequisities for making the armor..." -- which makes it clear that most of the time, no spells are required at all.
Sorry, but I am not sure how to use use quotes on this board but to quote dcollins:
"Everything else you're adding or asserting is purely house rules, and not supported by the rulebooks, and not used by other players other than your own group."
SO you have polled every single player of D&D and can state that as a fact or is this YOUR opinion, like I have mine? I have played in several groups that are not linked and they all use that variant. How did we miss your exhaustive polling. :b I think its just a difference of interpretation, just like the Constitution of the United States. There are those that interpret the rules by a strict method: "If the rules don't mention it, you can't do it." Others will interpret the rules as "If the rules don't expressly forbid it, you must be able to do it." I am more of the latter since it gives the best chance for flexibility and creativity. I also agree that the ability to imbue clothes as magical armor should require the Craft Magic Armors and Craft Wondorous Itesm feat to help balance things.
Hawkeye
"Everything else you're adding or asserting is purely house rules, and not supported by the rulebooks, and not used by other players other than your own group."
SO you have polled every single player of D&D and can state that as a fact or is this YOUR opinion, like I have mine? I have played in several groups that are not linked and they all use that variant. How did we miss your exhaustive polling. :b I think its just a difference of interpretation, just like the Constitution of the United States. There are those that interpret the rules by a strict method: "If the rules don't mention it, you can't do it." Others will interpret the rules as "If the rules don't expressly forbid it, you must be able to do it." I am more of the latter since it gives the best chance for flexibility and creativity. I also agree that the ability to imbue clothes as magical armor should require the Craft Magic Armors and Craft Wondorous Itesm feat to help balance things.
Hawkeye
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