Magic ranged weapons, Kind of a poorly worded section of the DMG

[ChimericDream]

I was looking at ranged weapons, and suddenly I'm not sure I've been doing it right. Here's a quote from the SRD:

Ranged Weapons and Ammunition

The enhancement bonus from a ranged weapon does not stack with the enhancement bonus from ammunition. Only the higher of the two enhancement bonuses applies.

Ammunition fired from a projectile weapon with an enhancement bonus of +1 or higher is treated as a magic weapon for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction. Similarly, ammunition fired from a projectile weapon with an alignment gains the alignment of that projectile weapon (in addition to any alignment it may already have).

So, let's say I have a +2 longbow firing mundane arrows. Are the arrows considered magical, but with no +2 to damage? Or are they considered +2 arrows, gaining the appropriate damage bonus.

If the latter is the case, why would anyone bother enchanting ammunition? Seems to me it would be cheaper to simply enchant the weapons and let that carry through to the ammo.

I'm inclined to say that the first option is the correct one. Ammunition is considered magic when fired from a magical weapon, but it does not gain an enhancement bonus. But then the line "Only the higher of the two enhancement bonuses applies." throws me for a loop. If the bow has a bonus of +5 and the arrows are +4, this line (to me) means that the arrows are now +5 arrows.

And now that I've talked myself in circles, help please! Is anyone able to make sense of this?

 

[ThirdWizard]

The key quote is "Only the higher of the two enhancement bonuses applies." So, you get the higher of the two enhancement bonuses to the attack and damage.

 

[Hypersmurf]

So, let's say I have a +2 longbow firing mundane arrows. Are the arrows considered magical, but with no +2 to damage? Or are they considered +2 arrows, gaining the appropriate damage bonus.

They gain the +2 to attack and damage rolls. Effectively, they take on the +2 enhancement bonus of the weapon.

If the latter is the case, why would anyone bother enchanting ammunition? Seems to me it would be cheaper to simply enchant the weapons and let that carry through to the ammo.

Firstly, someone might make fifty +1 arrows, and parcel ten out to each party member, so that everyone can beat DR X/Magic at low level without having to spend ten thousand gp on a magic weapon for everyone.

Secondly, a common tactic is to make a +5 bow (50,000gp) with +1 flaming arrows (8,000gp)... where a +5 flaming bow would cost 72,000gp.

If the bow has a bonus of +5 and the arrows are +4, this line (to me) means that the arrows are now +5 arrows.

Effectively.

-Hyp.

 

[Owen K.C. Stephens]

You do, in fact, get a +2 enhancement bonus to hit and damage if you fire a mundane arrow from a +2 magic bow. So, most people enchant their bows as soon as they can afford to.

However, this does not make enchanted arrows useless, though they are mostly useful only for higher-level characters. For example, if you've gotten to the point you can afford a +3 bow, you may decide you'd prefer +2 flaming or something similar. The problem is, if you run into a red dragon, that's not real useful.

However, if you're worried you can buy a dozen or so +1 frost arrows. Since the cost to enchant arrows is for 50, buying just 10 isn't that expensive. You keep the frost arrows until you need them. even though they're only +1 you get your +2 from the bow, and you still get +1d6 frost damage.

Know you're facing off against dragons? Buy some +1 bane vs dragon arrows. You don't want to spend the money for a whole bow that does that, but ten arrows you may use in one adventure. Heck, buy some bane vs giants and bane vs aberrations, which you're sure to run in to at -some- point.

At higher levels, it can be a great idea to buy a bunch of different arrows, so their special properties can stack with the base bonus of the bow, and be specialized for the situations you face.

 

[ChimericDream]

Ok. That makes a lot of sense. I've read that passage dozens of times, but for some reason, today it decided to confuse the hell out of me. I don't know if I just read it wrong at first, thus throwing myself into confusion, or what....

Thanks for the help.

 

[Dross]

If the latter is the case, why would anyone bother enchanting ammunition? Seems to me it would be cheaper to simply enchant the weapons and let that carry through to the ammo.

While i agree with Hyp, I see the bow/ammo as:
Bows/crossbows are a "use all the time" weapon, but magically enhanced ammo are "affect a specific target" item especially one that is not encountered often. Ammo is especially useful for having a 2nd enhancement to overcome a DR/A and B (given prior warning).

Edit: changed CD to DR

 

[Vraille Darkfang]

Ammo is especially useful for having a 2nd enhancement to overcome a CD/A and B (given prior warning).

Why bother with the 2nd enchantment on the ammo? When it's as useful (or moreso)and more Cost Effective to have a bunch of arrows made of different metals to overcome various DR first.

DR X/Adamantine; DR X/Silver; DR X/Cold Iron; If your DM allows various Sourcebooks there is even base metals that are treated as Good/Evil for purposes of overcoming Damage Reduction.

If you buy in to the "Golf Bag" Theory; then your quiver makes a rather handy Golf Bag where you don't have to go through 9-10 Commoner 'Caddies' toting all your various weapons.

 

[Sidekick]

Havinga group of +1 something arrows is very useful. And easily available at low-mid levels.

A single +1 flaming arrow only costs 167 gp. So does any arrow that only has a +2 equivalent bonus.

It helps for everyone (or at least all those with decent ranged weapons) to have a variety or minor magical arrows – for utilities sake of course!

Oh and also making a +1 silver bow for use against a vampire is awkward/impossible.

Carrying around/buying some +1 alchemical silver arrows is dead easy! (forgive the pun)

 

[moritheil]

Don't forget that weird trick arrows exist, like brilliant energy arrows that bestow negative levels.

 

[Dross]

Why bother with the 2nd enchantment on the ammo? When it's as useful (or moreso)and more Cost Effective to have a bunch of arrows made of different metals to overcome various DR first.

DR X/Adamantine; DR X/Silver; DR X/Cold Iron; If your DM allows various Sourcebooks there is even base metals that are treated as Good/Evil for purposes of overcoming Damage Reduction.

If you buy in to the "Golf Bag" Theory; then your quiver makes a rather handy Golf Bag where you don't have to go through 9-10 Commoner 'Caddies' toting all your various weapons.

I didn't meant to give the arrow with two enhancements, but to have one enhancement that is useful all the time on the bow (flaming, alignment) and another on the arrow such as bane (the "2nd" enhancement)

As Sidekick said, somethings cannot be done with a bow alone. IIRC Devils and Demons have an alignment AND metal type DR, and a bow does not confer it's make up to the arrows (otherwise all arrows would be wood and bolts both wood and metal).