Magic Vestment

[Jondor_Battlehammer]

Re: Cool

I think you guys might actually be using a +5 stick of dead horse beating. Where'd you find it?

LOL! Nice one!


I will admit that I'm a bit lost as to wether or not this, "discussion", is about the spell's effects anymore, but my first interpretation, and that of every one I play with is as follows.

(Assuming a 15th level caster.)

ARMOUR AC

Shirt +5
Leather +6
Plate +13
Plate +1 +13

Plate +1, Speed +13

Adamantine Plate +13

Adamantine Plate +1 +13

Adamantine Plate +1 /
Speed / +5 Luck bonus
to AC +18


My interpretation is that the spell creates a short lived bonus as if it had been enchanted permenently as per the item creation rules.

Thus it DOES stack to the armour's base AC, as does any enhancment.

It does NOT stack, but overlaps, other enhancements, such as Master Work, Adamantine, or alredy being a +1, (this example being a total of a +1 bonus.)

It Does stack with luck bonuses as they are LUCK bonuses, which would be added in as seperate effects on the same item, i.e., a belt granting both a Con and Dex bonus.

I will agre that it is poorly written, but the above jives best with the way the rest of the game works, and I belive is the simplest interpretation. The razor aside, I know how common opinions are, and will now duck behind my tower shield while casting Shield, 3.0.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Jondor, I agree with you completely.

(Perhaps there's strength in numbers. )

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Jondor's interpretation is the one.

 

[Pickaxe]

My interpretation:

The spell adds an enhancement bonus to one armor or shield. The sentence about normal clothes allows "no armor" to be a type of armor. It won't do anything for armor or shields that already have an enhancement bonus equal to or higher than that provided by the spell, because enhancement bonuses don't stack. If the text about total bonuses has any relevance still, it would govern other types of (non-armor) bonuses besides enhancement.

I like the analogy with GMW. Given that weapons don't have anything analogous to armor bonuses, it's understandable that there would be confusion in translating a weapon-enhancing spell to armor.

I don't agree that the current version is meant to not affect armor or at least heavier armor. It is, after all, a cleric spell, and a Strength domain spell as well, which leads me to think that it's not just meant to protect lightly-armored characters.

--Axe

 

[blakwind]

Like I said though, I'm now doubting myself.

Okay, Okay. You guys have convinced me. Confusing text notwithstanding, Magic Vestment was intended to be the defensive version of Greater Magic Weapon, and should operate the same way.
I concede the point.

 

[dcollins]

An interesting response from the Sage on this issue...

The current "magic vestment" spell has a fairly odd note at the end of the description. Separate from the +5 enhancement limit from the spell itself, it says: "A suit of armor cannot have more than +5 in total bonuses (even if some of its bonus is from other than enhancement)." I'm wondering what, exactly, this is putting a limit on.

It refers to special qualities the armor might have, see page 180 in the DMG.

Is this saying: (A) "magic vestment" cast on chainmail gives no improvement because it's already at +5 total armor bonus, or (B) "magic vestment" can only give a +4 enhancement if a piece of armor already had a +1 luck bonus (for example), or (C) a mangled restatement of the spell's enhancement limit, or (D) a mangled restatement of normal stacking rules? (In short, I'm wondering exactly what bonuses "other than enhancement" are of concern here.)


None of the above.
The text actually should read:

A suit of armor cannot have more than +10 in total bonuses (even if some of its bonus is from other than enhancement).

For example, a suit of +1 armor of moderate fortification and spell resistance (17) has an effective bonus of +8 (+1 enhancement, +3 fortification, +4 SR).

The armor can gain only +2 more enhancement.