Maintain and Damage?

[Yair]

There is a power that, if hit, causes damage. It then says you can sustain as a Minor action, which causes x damage (save ends). What does this mean?

Can you sustain if you didn't hit?
Can you sustain on the same round you've hit?
If you don't sustain that round, can you sustain the next round?

 

[Mathew_Freeman]

There is a power that, if hit, causes damage. It then says you can sustain as a Minor action, which causes x damage (save ends). What does this mean?

Can you sustain if you didn't hit?
Can you sustain on the same round you've hit?
If you don't sustain that round, can you sustain the next round?

Can you name the specific power you're talking about, so that we can use the compendium to see exactly what the text says? It would make explaining it a lot easier.

 

[Yair]

Can you name the specific power you're talking about, so that we can use the compendium to see exactly what the text says? It would make explaining it a lot easier.

Not from work IIRC it's a warlock power, of level... errgg... 6-8? I'll get back to you on that...

 

[Ibixat]

Not from work IIRC it's a warlock power, of level... errgg... 6-8? I'll get back to you on that...

Going to assume you mean the level 5 daily Curse of the Bloody fangs, hit is damage, miss half damage, sustain is the target and any enemy adjacent takes 1d10 (save ends)

1 First round you cast it and hit, target takes damage, if you miss target takes half of that damage.

2 On the targets turn it gets to make a save. It doesn't take any damage or complications from having the effect on him during it's turn, it just gets to save at the end of it's turn to end your effect. IF it saves go to step 5, if it fails step 3.

3 Back to your turn, you now get to choose to sustain the power or not, if you sustain the target and all adjacent enemies take 1d10 and on to step 4. If you do not sustain it is finished and no longer sustainable so you go to step 5

4 On to the enemies turn, they get their save at the end of their turn to end the power again, if they save on to step 5. If they fail their save you go back to step 3.

5 Power has ended, no more sustains or saves

There is no wording in sustain descriptions (pg 59,278 phb) or the power description (pg 134 phb) that indicate you need to hit to sustain anything, just in case anyone mentions that.

 

[logopolis]

The detailed rules about sustaining powers are on page 278 of the Player's Handbook.

Can you sustain if you didn't hit?

Yes. You can sustain a power regardless if you hit or miss with the initial attack.

Can you sustain on the same round you've hit?

No. You start sustaining on the round after the initial attack.

If you don't sustain that round, can you sustain the next round?

No. If you stop sustaining, the effect ends.

 

[Hypersmurf]

2 On the targets turn it gets to make a save.

I disagree with this one - there is no Save Ends effect until the first time you sustain the power.

Round 1, you hit and deal damage or miss and don't deal damage.
Round 2, you sustain and deal damage... and now there is a Save Ends effect, so on the targets turn, he gets a saving throw.

-Hyp.

 

[logopolis]

2 On the targets turn it gets to make a save. It doesn't take any damage or complications from having the effect on him during it's turn, it just gets to save at the end of it's turn to end your effect.

I agree with this interpretation. The caster's ability to sustain the spell is a negative effect that has been placed on the target. The target should be allowed to save against it, just like ongoing damage or any other ongoing effect.

 

[Gweldorf]

I disagree with this one - there is no Save Ends effect until the first time you sustain the power.

Round 1, you hit and deal damage or miss and don't deal damage.
Round 2, you sustain and deal damage... and now there is a Save Ends effect, so on the targets turn, he gets a saving throw.

-Hyp.

This is how I run it as well.

Until the sustain effect kicks in, there is nothing to save against.

 

[Rafe]

Just remember that ongoing damage occurs at the beginning of a turn while saves against them are at the end of a turn.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Just remember that ongoing damage occurs at the beginning of a turn while saves against them are at the end of a turn.

Right, though in the particular case of Curse of the Bloody Fangs, there's no ongoing damage; rather, the Sustain line deals damage, and the Sustain line is (save ends).

-Hyp.