Making Eldritch Blasts non-lethal...

[Raspen]

would it be possible to use EB at a lower lvl doing only 1d6 damage (effectively lowering the caster lvl) dispite your real caster lvl?

 

[frankthedm]

would it be possible to use EB at a lower lvl doing only 1d6 damage (effectively lowering the caster lvl) dispite your real caster lvl?

Possible, but dealing any lethal damge is intent to kill. Not likely to happen with the way HP scale, but something to keep in mind.

 

[rgard]

While the power source does not need to be Infernal, Abyssals or Wild fey and can be picked by the player, the class itself indicated the “Patron” must be accepting of Chaos and Evil and any warlock in that alignment arc. It stretches credulity a Celestial source would be accepting of lawful evil and reject Lawful Good.


For the weight that the FAQ carries, here is wotc’s suggestion on alignment violating warlocks.
What happens to a warlock who changes his alignment to LG, LN, NG, or N?
A warlock who isn’t evil or chaotic can’t gain any further levels as a warlock, but doesn’t lose any class features or suffer any other penalty.

"Chaos and Evil???????" Nope again, Frank. The class description no where says that the "partron" must be accepting of Chaos and Evil. Furthermore, the alignment restriction is "Any evil or any chaotic." See Complete Arcane, pg 7. Bold added by me.

Frank also wrote:

"It stretches credulity a Celestial source would be accepting of lawful evil and reject Lawful Good."

This is a straw man argument. If you substitute 'lawful evil' with 'chaotic good' in the above sentence, it would match the alignment restrictions of the class (what WotC wrote), but then would no longer stretch credulity if the patron is chaotic good.

Also:

"Evil warlocks sometimes seek the favor of cruel and and bloodthirsty deities, while good warlocks often turn to the worship of noble and true deities for the strength to win the battle raging in their tortured souls."

- from the Religion section of the class description on page 6.

It really comes down to this. When I read the the class description the alignment requirement in my Complete Arcanes states: Any evil or any chaotic.

I don't know maybe there is an earlier printing that says the alignment must be chaotic and evil, but that would contradict most of the flavor text so I don't think that exists.

At the end of the day, any DM can determine that for his or her campaign the warlock has to be chaotic and evil and can't ever use eldritch blast as non-lethal damage. You just have to fiat that or steer your players that way. It's the DM's call as to which classes are usable in the campaign and the DM's call as to any changes to the classes he or she wants to make.

Thanks,
Rich

Just to keep everything straight, I added the bold font style to the quotes above. It's just straight un-bolded text in my Complete Arcane.

 

[frankthedm]

You are misreading what i posted

"Chaos and Evil???????" Nope again, Frank. The class description no where says that the "partron" must be accepting of Chaos and Evil. Furthermore, the alignment restriction is "Any evil or any chaotic." See Complete Arcane, pg 7. Bold added by me.

Your own quote shows you what that means

It really comes down to this. When I read the the class description the alignment requirement in my Complete Arcanes states: Any evil or any chaotic.

By the class’s write up whatever source the warlock's power come from has to accept the warlock being Chaotic Good, Chaotic Neutral, Chaotic Evil, Neutral Evil or Lawful Evil and has to allow the warlock to change between those alignments.

 

[rgard]

You are misreading what i postedYour own quote shows you what that means By the class’s write up whatever source the warlock's power come from has to accept the warlock being Chaotic Good, Chaotic Neutral, Chaotic Evil, Neutral Evil or Lawful Evil and has to allow the warlock to change between those alignments.

Hi Frank,

No, I haven't mis-read what you posted.

After you posted that the alignment restriction was chaotic and evil, I posted that it is chaotic or evil.

Now in subsequent posts including the one above you do agree that it is chaotic or evil. So in that respect, we are on the same sheet of music at this point in the thread.

That said, I don't know where the question of alignment change comes from in your post.

Edit: spell check.

Thanks,
Rich

 

[frankthedm]

After you posted that the alignment restriction was chaotic and evil, I posted that it is chaotic or evil.

Now you are intentional misquoting me. I never said the Warlock had to Chaotic and Evil. I did say "Nope" to the Patron being a celestial one since I feel there is no way a celestial patron would accept the warlock being Neutral Evil or Lawful Evil as is allowed by the class. I will also admit it looked like i said no to the Chaotic good warlock.

As far as the nature of the power, Feind or Fey, the acceptable alignments sure seem to be pointing one direction.

LE>>NE>>CE<<CN<<CG

 

[rgard]

You are misreading what i postedYour own quote shows you what that means By the class’s write up whatever source the warlock's power come from has to accept the warlock being Chaotic Good, Chaotic Neutral, Chaotic Evil, Neutral Evil or Lawful Evil and has to allow the warlock to change between those alignments.

Ok Frank, I re-read your posts reference the patron or source vis a vis the alignment of the warlock.

You write that the source or patron must be accepting of the warlock's alignment or change of alignment. As the DM roleplays the patron or source, it sounds like you are implying that the source or patron (as played by the DM) can deny the warlock's alignment...or doesn't have to accept it.

It is just not so by what is stated in the Complete Arcane. The warlock can be completely divorced from restraint or control of the source or patron. The only restriction is the alignment must be chaotic or good.

If you agree with the above, that's good. If not, that's good too. If we don't agree at this point, we probably won't at least on this issue.

Thanks,
Rich

 

[rgard]

Now you are intentional misquoting me. I never said the Warlock had to Chaotic and Evil. I did say "Nope" to the Patron being a celestial one since I feel there is no way a celestial patron would accept the warlock being Neutral Evil or Lawful Evil as is allowed by the class. I will also admit it looked like i said no to the Chaotic good warlock.

As far as the nature of the power, Feind or Fey, the accepable alignments sure seem to be pointing one direction.

LE>>NE>>CE<<CN<<CG

No Frank, I'm just reading what you posted. Now given, you think I misquoted you, I've yet again re-read your posts.

You wrote chaotic and evil in posts 6 and 29. In post 6, if you didn't mean to have your 'nope' refer to the chaotic or evil, you should not have quoted the original poster's chaotic or evil. In post 29, a better way to get your point across would be to have written chaotic and or evil.

That said, you do mention alignment violations in your first post, which does imply chaotic and evil.

Anyway, it doesn't matter now. I think we beat this one to death and for the most part we are on the same sheet.

Thanks,
Rich

 

[DungeonmasterCal]

Nope. Read the class. A DM is entitled to change it if they so desire, but the wclass right up is pretty solidly entrench in that the power comes from a very wicked sourse.

Over on the Wizards' boards there are some variant warlocks who gain their powers from different sources (celestial, fey, etc). Some of their invocations are the same w/different names, while others are new entirely.

edit: Here's the link.

http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=370164

 

[brehobit]

I'd allow the EB to be non-leathal as for either a feat or a least invokation.

But that's just me, that's what I like